What's the deal with Burrell?

by The Navigator on Aug 26, 2006 12:12 AM EDT Comment 11 comments

Where the heck is the Phils' rightfielder? Not only was he replaced in the starting lineup for Friday night's game against the Mets - at Shea, where he's pummeled the ball - by Joe Thurston, but several pinch hitting opportunities come up and Cholly (and later Varsho once Cholly was tossed) sent up Jose Hernandez and Danny Sandoval and Chris Roberson. Sandoval didn't even stay in the game. And this is a game that was close the whole way through. Turns out he's day-to-day, but if you're critical to the team, and they're in a critical game, don't they usually play you so long as you're not on the DL?

I hadn't heard about Burrell being hurt, aside from the foot owies he's dealt with all season long - but turns out Rotowire says "Burrell was out of the starting lineup Friday with a sore left wrist, the team's official web site reports. "I'm fine," Burrell said. "I just felt it on a swing and thought we should give it a few days."".

Uh, if you're 'fine', don't you play down the stretch - that is, if your team hasn't totally lost confidence in you? Last I checked, his August OPS was around .780 - not what you'd like to see, but... Danny Sandoval? I mean, the Phils were trying to win this game, right?

I understand that Burrell has platoon issues, but, man, when they don't bring you into a close, must-win game at all, in your favorite park to hit, and they send up Sandoval and Thurston and Hernandez, what does that say? I mean, they sent up Roberson - and not just for defense like usual; he actually hit for Rhodes.

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Burrell

I think it's pretty clear that they want him gone. But it's also clear, at least to me, that he's still no worse than the fourth or fifth best bat on the team. If he's healthy, he should be in there 5-6 times a week.

by dajafi on Aug 28, 2006 4:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

He needs to be gone.

Although I think he tries, he is not good. If he could just DH and not have to worry about fielding. He is the only person that does not fit this lineup. If his strike outs are out of this lineup they have a much better chance of scoring runs. I said the same thing about Abreu and his strikeouts. Strikeouts kills rallies. This lineup has potential to have good rallies. His HR could be made up easily.

by Philsin06 on Aug 28, 2006 9:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

You've got your head in the sand

You've got your head in the sand about strikeouts. For instance, did you see in this piece that the Phils actually struck out more as a team after Abreu left (when their offense was on fire) than before (when it wasn't)? Or, have you noticed the incredible offensive year Ryan Howard is having, despite being second in the majors in strikeouts?

I could go on about how strikeouts are pretty much irrelevant, but I know you're playing ostrich right now so there's no point.

by David S. Cohen on Aug 29, 2006 9:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

dude its one thing

to have different people strikeing out in different times then Burrell striking out all the time. You can't use howard as a defense for Burrell. one bats .294 the other .256, one has 48 HR one has 24, one has 122 RBI and the other has 80. If Burrell was putting up Howards numbers then i could careless how many times he strikes out but he doesn't. You can't even compare the two. Due you see that Burrell is now a part time player.

you said the same thing before when we had this conversation. I said the lineup would be better without Abreu SO's. And it is. they have scored more runs. As a team they might SO more but that is also divided among 9 batters. Like I said before any contact with a ball can move a runner, but a SO can't. How you can argue that i can't understand. While Howard does have those SO his production more then makes up for it not to mention he has 100 more AB then Burrell. Out of the players with 100 K's Burrell has the least amount of AB most by 100 AB. We already went through this before and i told you the phillies would be better without Abreu's SO and they are.

you talk about Howard vs. Burrell, Burrell's SO rate is higher then Howards. Who's production is better. And as far as your PIECE goes, they avg the same SO. 1 K per every 4.8 AB. The difference being that there is not 1 batter SO (abreu) but as a team. Its spread out. There is a reason Burrell is now a platoon player. Although Howard has alot of SO, who is seeing better pitches howard or Burrell?

Unless Burrell was putting up Howards numbers, what would be more productive a SO or a hit ball either a FO, GO or Hit. any one of those can move a runner. A SO can't.

by Philsin06 on Aug 29, 2006 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I also need to point out

that Howard SO 1 per 3.7 plate Appr. while Burrell 1 per 4.2 PA. One strikes out swinging one strikes out looking. Howard has twice as many HR.

by Philsin06 on Aug 29, 2006 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Seeing if I understand...

So what you're saying is that concentrating your strikeouts in a couple players is worse than spreading them out among the whole lineup. And you've introduced no evidence to illustrate that, although the team has struck out MORE since Abreu was traded, the net effect of those increased K totals has been positive for the offense, nor have you shown that the other lineup spots are striking out more than they did before.

How are those goalposts? Still moving?

by WholeCamels on Aug 29, 2006 9:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Basically

What you're saying is that Burrell's strikeouts are bad because they are failures in key situations, but Howard's aren't as bad because he succeeds in key situations. So, why bother caring whether the success or failure is a strikeout? Why not just look at production? After all, if all of Burrell's strikeouts were turned into well-hit balls that were hard line drive outs to the pitcher, the team wouldn't be any better off. And, in fact, it probably would be much worse off as several of those line drive outs would result in double plays.

by David S. Cohen on Aug 30, 2006 9:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

and if

half of those SO were ground outs, fly outs they could score more runs or move runners. I am not looking to lose all SO that is not sensible. But watching a called 3rd strike over and over and over and over again is useless. Even a line ball to the pitcher is not a sure thing he will catch the ball.

by Philsin06 on Aug 30, 2006 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's outs that are the problem

It's his outmaking that's the problem in those situations. How he makes those outs is mostly irrelevant. Assume the out is made, that it was a strikeout is better than a line drive or ground ball double play and worse than a sacrifice. They basically cancel themselves out (although not completely), so who cares how the out is made. What matters is just that it is an out.

by David S. Cohen on Aug 30, 2006 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yes and no

depending on how many outs.

by Philsin06 on Aug 30, 2006 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

OK then

For the month of Aug, they already have more AB then any other month. With increased AB also would bring more K's. They Avg. almost the same amount of K's as they have all year. Although they have more AB then any month they are also walking more without abreu.

Utley has SO more, Nunez SO more then Bell, Rollins SO more then normal, Rowand has SO more, Burrells SO stay the same and RF is striking out alot less then RF. That is reason enough to show more SO throughout the lineup then just one player. But with more AB also will come more SO because you have more chances.

I can't tell you how they are hitting in situations since the trade. If you could find out for me you might find your reason.

by Philsin06 on Aug 30, 2006 8:35 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs