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Lineup with DH

Any thoughts on how the Phillies could/should configure their DH lineup for the games in TB?

Does Dobbs start at DH? Does Stairs?  How about Burrell as the DH...this could seemingly keep his bat in the lineup late in the game without having to make the defensive substitution. I wish that we could take Howard's defense - Chuck Knoblauch throwing syndrome and all - out of the equation, but I just don't see how that would work.

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Whats better? Burrell not in left or Howard not at first? The better question is probably Dobbs at first or Bruntlet/Jenkins. I think you have to go Dobbs at first against a righty, and Bruntlet in LF against a lefty, or Coste as Dh and Burrell in LF.

by Clyde Simmons on Oct 20, 2008 1:46 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I think there are a lot of options, but I really don’t like the idea of using Bruntlett as anything more than a late-game replacement. A bottom of the lineup featuring feliz, bruntlett, and ruiz is pure trash.

Steve Jeltz
.210/.308/.268
"If you condensed everything I ever did in my career into one game, it looks decent"

by Steve Jeltz on Oct 20, 2008 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Rollins SS
Werth RF
Utley 1B
Howard DH
Burrell LF
VIctorino CF
Dobbs 2B
Feliz 3B
Ruiz C

That’s a theory of mine. Of course, Utley is more comfortable at 2B, but he did start at 1B a lot during interleague play. If you really want to get Stairs in the lineup (which is likely), you just put him at DH and leave the team as-is for the field.

by Cory Williams on Oct 20, 2008 2:38 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

and by “started at 1B a lot” I meant twice.

by Cory Williams on Oct 20, 2008 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not quite…a half of the infield with two out of position players is just asking for it…would you want Dobbs turning a double play in a tight spot?

Steve Jeltz
.210/.308/.268
"If you condensed everything I ever did in my career into one game, it looks decent"

by Steve Jeltz on Oct 20, 2008 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think we’re just better off leaving our lineup alone, letting Dobbs DH, and leaving Stairs on the bench for another late inning “we need a PH HR” at bat…

"When you get that nice celebration coming into the dugout and you're getting your ass hammered by guys - there's no better feeling than to have that done." - Matt Stairs 10/13/08

Gold... Pure Gold...

by foos05 on Oct 20, 2008 3:37 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

definitely. it would be dumb dumb dumb to move dobbs to second base.

by char6587 on Oct 20, 2008 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

it all depends on righty-lefty shit

im sure charlie manuel will look for matchups unless it REALLY hurts us, as long as he doesnt do the Andy Reid take better players off field for matchups im happy

After Game 6 The Curse of Billy Penn will be shattered and...we party

by XxBleedGreen5xX on Oct 20, 2008 6:04 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I say start Stairs over the Dobbster

but that’s just my opinion.

Cuba Si! Yanqi No!
Mariner fan in Exile.
Proudly offending Ma'am since 10-18

by Patrick517 on Oct 20, 2008 6:33 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Interestingly, Tadahito Iguchi is 4 for 8 against Kazmir with a double, a triple, a homer, and two walks. Oh well.

by taco pal on Oct 20, 2008 7:27 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

against LHP: Coste at 1B, Howard at DH, everything else the same. Coste mauls LHP (.870 OPS in his career), there’s no way you can keep him out of the lineup—plus, if you put him at 1B, you can switch him to catcher without losing the DH.

Against RHP, if Manuel goes with Dobbs, Dobbs should be at 1B with Howard at DH. If it’s Stairs, everything else stays the same. I’m not sure who is the best bet….Dobbs is the better pinch hitting option (despite Stairs’ tremendous HR), but he also lets you improve your infield defense if you start him.

Also, this isn’t entirely related, but why is Taguchi on the roster instead of Golson? We all saw how ridiculously fast Golson is during the regular season, and, as my brother pointed out, he could be our Fernando Perez—who won Game 2 for the Rays as a PR on a ridiculously short sac fly. He can’t hit worth a lick, but Taguchi can’t do ANYTHING we ask him to do.

by bugbear on Oct 20, 2008 11:58 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Coste needs to play, somehow, against the LHP. I’d put him at 1B, and Howard at DH, which allows Coste to move to catcher w/o losing the DH. If that’s not workable, then he needs to be DH, with or without Marson on the roster.

Against RHP, Dobbs or Stairs is fine by me. I think Dobbs is the better PH, but playing him lets you DH Howard. I think Manuel might do it based on match ups, as Dobbs and Stairs have different approaches that probably work well against different pitchers.

Also, this is a bit off-topic, but shouldn’t Golson replace Taguchi on the roster? My brother pointed this out to me—Taguchi does NOTHING well, he’s a complete waste. Golson can’t hit a lick, but he’s super-duper fast. He could be our Fernando Perez—who won game 2 of the ALCS for the Rays on an extremely short sacrifice fly. And he can’t possibly bunt any worse.

by bugbear on Oct 21, 2008 12:06 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Just had an argument with a buddy of mine re: what to do with the DH against Kazmir. And I think you’ve hit the nail on the head here, bugbear. Bruntlett in the starting lineup is a waste (as is Taguchi, but that goes without saying), so I think the move has to be to DH Howard and play Coste at 1B. Coste sports a .316/.361/.503 line against LHP in his career, as opposed to a .269/.358.396 career line for Bruntlett.

And I just might agree with you on the other front as well: Taguchi serves no purpose on this roster. Golson is already at instructs, so there’s no way he makes the roster, but I’d still think about replacing Taguchi or Jenkins with Marson to free up Coste’s bat for PH duty. Oh well, clearly it’s not going to happen.

Oh by the way, my money’s on Cholly starting Bruntlett in left and DHing Burrell.

by PhillyFriar on Oct 21, 2008 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

sorry for the double post

don’t know what happened…feel free to delete the first.

by bugbear on Oct 21, 2008 12:17 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Charlie has said that he doesn’t expect any changes to the roster for the Series.

Taguchi is, I believe, a very good bunter who happened to screw up in his one most recent at-bat. Sample size, sample size, sample size.

Other things he doesn’t do very well. Still, I am not at all certain whether he went off a cliff this season at age 38 (wouldn’t be the first guy) or if his lousy stats are just the result of (again) small sample size. For his career, he had around a 90 OPS+ going into this year. I think that’s in the average range for a bench player. I was against his signing because I thought it was a waste of money, not because I thought he was so terrible.

by taco pal on Oct 21, 2008 10:58 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I can understand sample size re: his hitting. The issue is, with bunting and fielding, he is given limited opportunities, and he hasn’t shown the ability to convert them, especially in the field where he had a couple egregious misplays. Perhaps that’s a poor showing, but it shows how little marginal value he offers as well. Golson’s speed is much more tangible, and has greater value on a bench that has no few average runners, let alone above average.

by bugbear on Oct 22, 2008 12:58 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Are there stats on his bunting success rate (this year and career)? I honestly have no idea how he’s done overall, but I suspect that his failure in LCS Game One might be a little too fresh in our minds.

I recall the defensive miscues earlier in the year. Were those typical or uncharacteristic?

by taco pal on Oct 22, 2008 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I’m not sure, and you have a point, if we can agree that good bunting is all he’s supposed to provide…well, that’s why you’re allowed to pinch hit pitchers. Throw Jamie Moyer out there instead.

by bugbear on Oct 22, 2008 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The more I think about it, the more I hate what the DH or lack of DH has done to the difference in the leagues. It creates a significantly unfair balance for NL teams especially in short series. Not only do the Phillies not budget for a DH hitter in their lineup, they also must have players to complement the fact that they do not have a DH. This means having less specialized arms in the pen to eat innings if you need to pinch hit for your pitcher. It also means you need to have specialized players on your bench to help you double switch (which never happens in the AL). American League teams can fill their benches mainly with decent bats as these guys will likely not need to play the field unless they start there.

Just put the DH in the NL already.

For Who? My teammates.

For What? To Win.

How Much? Where do I sign?

by jonk on Oct 22, 2008 9:30 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

although I agree with your reasoning… if it came down it it, I’d much rather them just eliminate the DH from the AL… god forbid the multi-millionaire pitchers or DHs play both halves of the inning

"When you get that nice celebration coming into the dugout and you're getting your ass hammered by guys - there's no better feeling than to have that done." - Matt Stairs 10/13/08

Gold... Pure Gold...

by foos05 on Oct 22, 2008 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

agreed

yes, watching the pitcher bat is boring a lot of the time, but watching Brett Myers bat this off-season has been priceless. I also like the tactics it results in, but that’s understandably subjective.

by bugbear on Oct 22, 2008 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I really don’t like the pitcher hitting at all. It is a useless waste of time and basically almost makes the 8 hole hitter a better player than he should be. It’s no fun when the bottom of the order gets on base and the pitcher just craps it all away. It has nothing to do with money it has to do with functionality and enjoyment. I have never heard anyone say that they were happy to see the pitcher come up to bat.

For Who? My teammates.

For What? To Win.

How Much? Where do I sign?

by jonk on Oct 22, 2008 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i like it because of the strategy it involves… you have to think about consequences when pulling pitchers and pinch hitting… just my opinion though

"When you get that nice celebration coming into the dugout and you're getting your ass hammered by guys - there's no better feeling than to have that done." - Matt Stairs 10/13/08

Gold... Pure Gold...

by foos05 on Oct 22, 2008 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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