Roy Halladay: The Phillies Can Have a Future and an All-Star Pitcher
They've talked about it on Daily News Live, SportsCenter, MLB Network, and thanks to the Metro, Angelo Cataldi has chimed in (ugh). Your boss has an opinion (you bite your tongue), your grandpa wants him (but calls him "Holliday").
Roy Halladay is one of the three or four best starting pitchers in baseball, and he wants to pitch for the Phillies. Ruben, you can get this done, and you don't have to "mortgage the farm."
If you've been observing J.P. Ricciardi over the past couple of weeks, you've seen a desperate man holding a valuable commodity. He's puffing his chest and talking big, but in reality he has almost no leverage. He knows that he'll significantly less for Halladay if he waits until the offseason to trade him. And in the current economy, the Phillies are the only team with the talent and the resources to acquire Halladay and pay for him, now and in the future. Ruben and the Jets hold all of the cards here, and Ricciardi knows it. It's all puffery and posturing now.
Remember earlier this decade, the dance that Maestro Ed Wade would do when he had to dump a star player? First: "We need to be overwhelmed!" Then: "We need to get fair value." And at the end, he'd get bent over for a bag of magic beans and maybe Omar Daal as a throw-in. Doesn't it feel good to be on the opposite side of that now?
The fact that Toronto's OPENING demand here -- purportedly Kyle Drabek, J.A. Happ, and Dominic Brown -- is almost tolerable strongly indicates to me that this is going to get done, and that the Phillies are the only real players here. And even if that precise deal goes down, the Phillies still have a deep system of promising prospects -- Carlos Carrasco, Michael Taylor, Joe Savery, Jason Donald, Lou Marson, Travis D'Arnaud, Jason Knapp, etc. Say it with me: Trading for Roy Halladay is not the same as mortgaging the future! Losing Drabek and Brown would be disappointing, but getting yourself at least 1 1/2 seasons of Roy Halladay plus two draft picks if and when he leaves after 2010 kind of soothes the burn a little bit, huh?
And let's look at Roy Halladay's numbers in context. He's done what he's done pitching his entire career in the AL East, among the titans of the American League -- Boston, New York, and recently, Tampa Bay. He's not fattening up on mediocre competition. He's one of the best, dominating the best. Translate those numbers to the National League. Just look at CC Sabathia and Rich Harden last year.
Ruben: Be firm but get the deal done. They need to make this trade more than you do. Be fair and be prepared to give up a potential All-Star or two. And remember, this isn't Joe Blanton, or Kyle Lohse, all due respect to those guys.
This is Roy Halladay. Pull the trigger, Ruben.
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Comments
Just Do It, Phillies!
I would love if we could pull this trade off w/out giving up either Drabek or Brown but what it takes, we need to do the trade. I would love for Happ to be part of the deal and save Drabek. But after last night, I believe that is a pipe dream!
by DeanH on Jul 25, 2009 10:39 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
JA Happ
Happ could still be a part of it. Its not like the Cards were hitting rockets all night. They got a bunch of lucky flare shots that plated 4 runs. Scouts should pick up on that, so I dont think last nights showing will be all that big of a deal.
I think we should just surrender Brown. They want a top prospect, so why not have it be a guy who plays at the most replaceable position in baseball? Taylor makes more sense because he is going to need to play in the near future and our potential OF logjam has been well documented, but this trade isnt going to be perfect, so if the worst thing that comes out of this trade is that we give Brown instead of Taylor, thats totally fine by me.
As long as Drabeks not involved and Happ is, I will be glad (avoiding the Happy pun).
by philiafan14364 on Jul 25, 2009 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the Jays will want Brown over Taylor as they have an OF logjam as well, plus he’s generally rated a better prospect as he’s two years younger while putting up similar numbers.
The Jays might also prefer Knapp over Drabek; they seem to have a plethora of decent rotation filler, and might prefer a pitcher who’s a bit further from the majors so that by the time he’s ready, they’re closer to being rebuilt.
I would definitely do a package of Happ/Knapp/Brown/B-prospect.
by phatj on Jul 25, 2009 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Knapp
If they want him over Drabek thats fine by me. I doubt they will though because hes hurt right now, so I dont think they have had very many chances to see him live.
by philiafan14364 on Jul 25, 2009 11:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My understanding is that Knapp isn’t really “hurt” so much as they’re resting him to make sure his innings don’t get excessive.
Otherwise, I’d also much rather trade Taylor than Brown, and I was thinking he could be the piece that Ricciardi can point to and say “here’s a major league-ready player with star potential.” Getting someone/s who can contribute in the majors quickly enough to possibly save his job has to be one of the goals for JP.
by dajafi on Jul 25, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d still rather deal Happ and Knapp both than Drabek, and Taylor rather than Brown. But at this point, I’d probably not let anybody be a deal-breaker, and i wouldn’t want to see Halladay make another start for Toronto.
I think it will happen, at a price that will make us swallow hard but ultimately prove survivable.
by dajafi on Jul 25, 2009 11:37 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
When might this deal happen? Is there a trading deadline or something to consider?
by Ritty77 on Jul 25, 2009 11:40 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Is there a trading deadline?
July 31, or if you believe anything Ricciardi says, July 28.
by phatj on Jul 25, 2009 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We know Happ can pitch well, Drabek is still a Mystery
If I would go Happ, Drabek has injury questions too. JPR has no leverage, but everyone is saying the Jays are starting the deal with Happ & Drabeck then throwing in Brown or Taylor & 1 other guy, but that’s ridiculous. Phills should send Dobbs, Donald, Taylor/Brown/Mayberry, Drabeck (or Carrasco) & 1 other player for Halladay & Scutero. No other team can put up anywhere near a close offer too ones the Phills can put up, & why overspend. If Halladay gets moved we can still give the Jays the best offer & it won’t be close to what everyone is saying it will be
by sports00fan00 on Jul 25, 2009 11:54 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I know that Happ can pitch adequately and seems to be very lucky this year.
Reports on ESPN News this morning are that the phils are currently reluctant to include Happ and Drabek, but Mr Stark claims the phils have a list of ‘7 or 8’ players that the phils are ‘batting back and forth’ to make this deal work…
Don't frack with me or you'll get a punch in the kidneys...you've been warned
by jemagee on Jul 25, 2009 12:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It’s nice that the Phillies have a lot of high ceiling, impact type prospects to work with here. Drabek, Carrasco, Knapp, Marson, Taylor, Donald, Brown, D’Arnaud are all high value. Not to mention Happ. And I guess you can throw Kendrick in there. Something can definitely get done here. The question is how much is it going to hurt the Phillies down the road. I really don’t think the Phils need to give up Drabek or Brown, let alone both. Ultimately, Ruben can point to the fat lead the Phils have and wait till the winter, where he could probably get Halladay for something like just Happ and Taylor. The Phils are the only team with a serious chance of getting Halladay, and they are already cruising to the post-season. Seems like they hold the bargaining advantage. I just hope Amaro doesn’t start bidding against himself.
I suspect the Phils will counter with something including Taylor and Donald. Not because they are bad, but because of their ages. Yes, the Jays have a full outfield plus DH, but they could probably move someone to first to get Taylor playing. Millar/Overbay is a glaring hole at 1st. And Donald could step in for either Scutaro or Rolen.
by The R on Jul 25, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
wait till the winter
The main point of getting Halladay is that if he and Hamels are on their game, they give you a great shot to beat any of the other seven teams you might see in October. Not true of Hamels and Happ.
I’m hesitant too, because I see Drabek playing a big role for the Phillies as soon as 2010, but you have to be willing to overpay a little.
by dajafi on Jul 25, 2009 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pute the safety on, Ruben
Please. Safety first.
by James Kannengieser on Jul 25, 2009 4:18 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Parade 2009
The future is NOW!! Lets see…playoffs 2009, Who do we want on the mound..a future hall of fame Cy Young winner…or a future question mark? I say go for another parade down Broad Street in 2009!
by Philly Rox on Jul 26, 2009 12:02 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

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