Roy Halladay and the Top All-Time Phillies Post-Season Starting Pitching Performances
So you may have heard that Roy Halladay pitched a no-hitter two days ago. It was an amazing baseball moment, one that most of us will never forget.
But how does it rank among the top Phillies post-season starting pitching performances? Since Halladay's gem was the second no-hitter in post-season history, you'd be forgiven for thinking that, since the first no-hitter, Don Larsen's perfect game, was not pitched by a Phillie, the obvious answer is that Halladay's performance is the best ever by a Phillie in the playoffs.
Well, you'd be wrong. Below is a list of the top-10 playoff starting pitching outings by Phillies in their history. The methodology is simple. I used adjusted game score (GSa) to rank the performances. Game score is a simple formula that tallies up the various measures of a starting pitcher's performance and gives a number that approaches 100 (or even more) for the best pitching performances.
I adjusted it to reflect a few things. First, I added 5 points to the game score if the outing occurred in a Championship Series game and 10 points if it occurred in a World Series game. This adjustment reflects the increased importance of the various series. Second, I adjusted for the quality of the opposing hitters by adding the difference between the team's OPS+ and the average OPS+ (by definition, 100). So, if a team has an OPS+ of 104, 4 points were added to the game score. If a team had an OPS+ of 96, 4 points were taken off the game score. Third, I adjusted down if the game was against an AL team and the DH was not used. I took off 2 points since the lineup faced would be an easier one than the lineup reflected by the team OPS+. I also added 2 points for pitching in a clinching game, as that reflects the heightened pressure of that game. Finally, I added 5 points for a special game, one that you'll remember forever. Obviously, this is subjective, but I don't think the games I gave these points to will be that controversial.
From tenth to first, here's the list of the best Phillies post-season pitching performances:
10) Charles Hudson, Game 3, 1983 NLCS - GSa 77. The Phillies had split the first two games with the Dodgers in Los Angeles and returned home with Hudson on the mound. He went the distance, giving up 2 runs on 4 hits and 2 walks while striking out 9. The Phillies offense provided the fireworks, scoring 7 runs with an explosive game from Gary Matthews. Hudson's raw game score was 78. He had 5 points added on for pitching in the NLCS, but lost 6 points for facing a Dodgers' team that had a 94 OPS+ on the season.
t-8) Cole Hamels, Game 1, 2008 NLDS - GSa 85. Much like Halladay on Wednesday night, Hamels started the 2008 post-season for the Phillies with a statement game. He didn't complete the game, but he pitched a shutout through 8 innings, yielding only 3 baserunners (2 hits, 1 walk) while striking out 9. He threw a mere 101 pitches, 67 for strikes. Brad Lidge gave up a run in the 9th but closed it out for the Phillies, who beat the Brewers 3-1. Hamels' raw game score was 86, tied for the second-highest raw game score in Phillies' post-season history, but he got no extra bonus points for pitching in the NLDS and lost a point for facing the Milwaukee offense and its 99 OPS+.
t-8) Pedro Martinez, Game 2, 2009 NLCS - GSa 85. This is the game that elder-statesman Pedro will be remembered for. At the end of his career, he blanked the Dodgers through 7 innings, throwing only 87 pitches while allowing just 2 hits. He walked no one and struck out 3. He did it with guile and guts. Unfortunately, the Phillies' offense couldn't solve Vicente Padilla, so the Dodgers won 2-1 after scoring off of Chan Ho Park once Pedro was pulled. But Pedro was magical while he was in there, earning a game score of 76 in just 7 innings. He gets 5 points added for excelling in the NLCS and 4 points for facing a Dodgers' lineup with a 104 OPS+.
7) Grover Alexander, Game 2, 1915 World Series - GSa 86. In the Phillies first-ever post-season game (in year 33!), Alexander got the start and held the Red Sox to just 1 run. He wasn't as unhittable as others on this list, as he gave up 8 hits and 2 walks, but he struck out 6 and pitched a complete game. The Phillies won 3-1, the only game they'd win that series. Alexander's raw game score was 71, but he got another 10 points for pitching in the World Series and 5 for facing a Boston lineup that had a 105 OPS+ (along with a second-year Babe Ruth as a pinch hitter).
6) John Denny, Game 1, 1983 World Series - GSa 91. The Phillies made their fourth World Series appearance in 1983, and Cy Young Award-winner John Denny got the Game 1 start and pitched the Phillies to their only win that Series. He threw 7.67 innings allowing just a solo home run and 4 other hits. He walked no one and struck out 5. His raw game score was 70, but he got 10 points for pitching in the World Series and 11 for pitching against a powerful Orioles team that had a 111 OPS+.
5) Steve Carlton, Game 6, 1980 World Series - GSa 94. Given the iconic last two outs of Game 6, it'd be easy to forget that Lefty started the game and was brilliant. He pitched 7 innings and gave up just 1 run. He struck out 7, walked 3, and allowed 4 hits. He had a raw game score of 69, the lowest on this list, but he got extra points for doing this in the World Series (10 points), facing a good Royals lineup with an OPS+ of 108 (8 points), pitching in a clinching game (2 points), and pitching a special game, one that will go down in the history books (5 points).
4) Cliff Lee, Game 3, 2009 NLCS - GSa 95. Cliff Lee was masterful in the 2009 post-season, as the Dodgers learned in this game. He mowed down their lineup, allowing only 3 hits and striking out 10. He shut them out through 8 innings, with Chad Durbin pitching the 9th only because Lee was at 114 pitches and the game was so far out of reach, the Phillies having scored 11 runs. Lee's raw game score was 86, but he got 5 points for pitching in the NLCS and 4 points for facing the Dodgers with their 104 OPS+.
3) Curt Schilling, Game 5, 1993 World Series - GSa 100. One of my greatest in-person fan memories, as I traveled 360 miles to see this game with my dad. Schilling captivated the Vet crowd for 9 innings of brilliance. He struck out 6, walked 3, and allowed 5 singles. The Phillies won 2-0 and looked like they were scratching their way back into the Series. Alas, that didn't happen (warning: do not click link if you have a heart condition or are pregnant), but Schilling's amazing game was good for a raw game score of 80. He got 10 points for pitching in the World Series, 10 for facing a Blue Jays lineup that had a 110 OPS+, and 2 for pitching in a clinching game, as the Blue Jays would have won the Series had they won this game. He lost 2 points for facing a Blue Jays lineup without a DH.
2) Roy Halladay, Game 1, 2010 NLDS - GSa 107. What more is there to say? Halladay wowed us Wednesday night and made it look effortless. He allowed no hits and walked only one. He struck out 8 and almost none of the balls put into play were hit well. His night will be remembered forever. Halladay's raw game score was 94, the highest raw game score ever by a Phillie in the post-season. He gets an additional 8 points for pitching against a Reds team with a 108 OPS+ and 5 points for pitching a special game, a no-hitter.
1) Cliff Lee, Game 1, 2009 World Series - GSa 115. But Halladay's game is not the best ever by a Phillie, as Cliff Lee eclipsed him in the first game of the World Series last year. Lee dazzled over 9 innings, turning in a performance every bit as effortless as Halladay's no-hitter. Yes, he allowed a run (but it was unearned) and 6 hits, which is why his raw game score is only 83. But he struck out 10 and made two catches that virtually guarantee him a ridiculous Yankees contract this coming off-season. He did this in the first World Series game in the new Yankee stadium against a dominant Yankee lineup. He gets 10 points for pitching in the World Series and 22 points for facing a Yankee lineup that had a ridiculous 122 OPS+.
So there you have it. Roy Halladay's no-hitter was amazing, but Lee's complete game in the World Series last year was even better.
That doesn't sound right to you? Well, consider the differences between the two. Lee struck out 2 more than Halladay but allowed 5 more base runners. Advantage Halladay. But, Lee accomplished his feat on the biggest stage in baseball, both in the importance of the game and the particular location, Yankee stadium. Most importantly, however, Lee did it against a lineup that puts the 2010 Reds to shame, and that's not disparaging the Reds this year at all. Compare the players on the two teams and tell me how many Reds you'd take over a Yankee at the same position. I think the only clear advantage for the Reds is 2010 Joey Votto over 2009 Mark Teixeira, but even that is close, as Big Tex was still a pretty dominant hitter in 2009. Add in that Lee was facing a lineup that also included Hideki Matsui and his 133 OPS+ at DH, and it's clear that Cliff Lee shut down a much better lineup than Roy Halladay did, and the rankings here reflect that.
That's not to take away anything from Roy Halladay, of course. What he did was spectacular, and we'll treasure the memory forever. It just wasn't the best ever by a Philadelphia Phillie in the post-season. So far, Cliff Lee still holds onto that honor.
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I loved the catch Lee made where he barely had to move. Just held out his glove. The shrug and grin just makes it. All that being said, I think this provides clear evidence for one thing. Never should have traded Cliff Lee…
Let the beasting begin.
I think David left 5 points on the table there. That is one of the 2 or 3 most memorable Phillies games I’ve ever seen. And nobody here can say that won’t remember that game 30 years from now, even if only for the catch you mentioned here.
Definitely- Lee was amazing that night, and I will never forget it. Particularly his demeanor with that pop up- just making it look so relaxed and nonchalant- almost like he was playing ball in the backyard with his kids, not pitching the biggest game of his life. As much as I like Halladay, and I am very glad that he is here. I still miss Cliff Lee.
by dannijd on Oct 8, 2010 1:01 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Ehhh
I think that you’re trying to assign scores to something that is not quantifiable. Baseball is all about stats, but we’re talking about moments in time. The fact is, with all the pressure in the world on his shoulders, Roy went and did what one other pitcher has done in the history of baseball.
Cliff Lee is second in my mind. It was a great performance but people remember it more for a nonchalant catch than the balls he was pitching. I was at Roy’s no no, and I saw grown men cry. I saw children ask their fathers if Roy was the best pitcher who ever lived, and I saw them reply yes. I saw old timers who told me that the last time this had happened they’d been my age, and that they were sure they’d die before it happened again.
On Baseball tonight they said that according to Game score, Tiny Tim’s 14 k performance last night was better than Roy Halladay’s no no. Doug Glanville and Tim Kirkjan laughed at that and I did too. Sometime’s shiny Ks and backwards Ks blind people.
The fact is, in all my life, watching sports almost every day, I’ve never seen one man completely dominate a team like Roy Halladay did two days ago. He could have won that game with the GCL phillies behind him.
by Jayson Werth's beard on Oct 8, 2010 9:59 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
It is all about what you value though. Game score values pitchers that put up alot of K’s. The writer of this post values great performances in the World Series, above great performances in a division or league championship series.
You might value historical performances, like Halladay’s no hitter.
None of thes are wrong opinions and you could not go wrong with either Lee’s or Halladay’s performance ranked at the top.
I’m not sure what’s so laughable about Lincecum’s game score being higher than Halladay’s. Dominance comes in different forms, and strikeouts are certainly one form.
And think of what a no-hitter is. It means that the other team doesn’t get a hit but they do get men on base in other ways. Isn’t it odd in this day and age of OBP instead of BA to celebrate a no-hitter when we know that what matters is (for pitchers) keeping men off the bases and (for hitters) getting on base, no matter how you do it?
Again, I’m not disparaging what Halladay did. He was brilliant. But, the special significance of a “no-hitter,” which I will be the first to admit that I buy into, seems misplaced given what we now know about baseball.
by David S. Cohen on Oct 8, 2010 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
To piggy back off of that, when you can throw an no hitter and lose, it shows that a no hitter is not necessarily a top pitching performance.
Seen here for one example:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/HOU/HOU196404230.shtml
If we know that though, Roy still only let one man on base, on what may have been a questionable walk. K’s are over-rated though. They are important with men on base already, and they intimidate, but they aren’t as efficient as ground ball outs usually.
by Jayson Werth's beard on Oct 8, 2010 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions
True, they’re not as efficient as a 1 or 2 pitch batted-ball out, but that’s about the only thing they have going against them in comparison. In about almost every other way, they’re vastly superior.
by David S. Cohen on Oct 8, 2010 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions
Vastly?
Slightly superior, sure, but an out is an out.
by Phrozen on Oct 8, 2010 11:19 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
That’s only if you’re looking at it after the fact. Before the fact, you know that if you strike someone out you’re going to strike him out. If you know you’re going to induce a groundball, there’s only a 75% chance or whatever that you’re going to get him out.
Precisely. On a batted ball, lots of things can happen that are bad. On a strikeout, it’s very very rare that something bad happens.
by David S. Cohen on Oct 8, 2010 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions
That isn’t true though!
Cmon, are you saying the fact that Roy had one ball leave the infield all night is a product of luck then?
Mariano Rivera doesn’t try to strike people out, he shatters their bats by coming inside with the same pitch 10000000 times, and he’s the most reliable clockwork reliever there is. Sure he’ll get strike outs, but he isn’t trying for them. He’s trying to break bats.
by Jayson Werth's beard on Oct 8, 2010 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions
If you know you’re going to induce a groundball, there’s only a 75% chance or whatever that you’re going to get him out.
That doesn’t tell the whole story. It depends a lot on who is playing in your infield and it depends on what kind of ground ball we’re talking about, they aren’t all created equal. Roy’s pitches were moving so sharply that they never had a chance to get a hit.
I’m not saying K’s suck here, don’t get me wrong. I know that they’re valuable. Maybe I should have been clearer in the first place.
Game score is already arbitrary in the ways it assigns points to “good pitching performances”. The method used here made it more arbitrary. Roy Halladay shut down the most prolific offence in our league, and the MVP of it, in his first playoff start, and was one strike away from doing it completely perfectly.
You say that K’s are only equal after the fact. Well, it is after the fact, and during Lee’s game an unearned run scored. It isn’t his fault, but Roy was never going to let anyone have that fault. Roy, by virtue of his rbi and his no no, literally won a playoff game as close to single handedly as is possible.
The only instance in Philly sports history to match it is the 100 point game. And I don’t know if it does. Roy Halladay has pitched the definitive playoff game of my lifetime.
by Jayson Werth's beard on Oct 8, 2010 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, it is after the fact, and during Lee’s game an unearned run scored. It isn’t his fault, but Roy was never going to let anyone have that fault.
Huh? Roy gave up several groundballs, which leave the margin open for errors.
Yea I suck at conveying what I should be saying here. I understand that as an argument for halladay this sucks so much c0cks. But you saw what I saw. There will never be a Phillies pitcher who pitches a better game than that.
by Jayson Werth's beard on Oct 8, 2010 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t be too sure of that. Halladay’s perfect game was a superior performance. He didn’t walk anybody, and he only allowed 19 balls in play vs 23 in the no-no, meaning he was reliant on the defense four fewer times. Yes, it was a weaker team and it wasn’t in the playoffs but the point is that Halladay could, scary as it is to imagine, do better.
OK so you’ve cited one absurd outlier (Rivera) and alluded to another (Halladay) to make a general point about the other 99.3% of MLB pitchers.
http://www.thegoodphight.com
He’s not an absurd outlier, he is a human pitcher who exists and will be treated as such.
by Jayson Werth's beard on Oct 8, 2010 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions
I know I have a point here, and I know you guys are better at conveying it than me. You guys probably know baseball better than I do, you run this blog.
I want you to forget what I’ve said in my bumbling stumbling posts, and I want to rephrase.
In your heart of hearts, do you believe that the definitive way to compare these two starts is through a game score?
In your heart of hearts, are you not convinced that what you have seen is the single most dominating performance in Philly sports by one man?
by Jayson Werth's beard on Oct 8, 2010 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s like I said above, measuring these types of performances is subjective. Game score is not the end all be all of great performances. Ranking Halladay’s game against Lee’s is subjective and it is all about how you value different aspects. No hitters are great but to shut down the great Yankees offense in the World Series is just as incredible.
It might also have something to do with the Perfect Game earlier. Sometimes you see a game like that from Dallas Braden, or a no no from Matt Garza, and you say, eh the stars aligned today, but he’s not that good. Halladay is that good. He literally has the talent to go out any night and throw a perfect game.
And part of it has to do with the fact that I was there jumping around and screaming and I really really want it to be the most epic performance there has been, for selfish reasons.
:)
I don’t know if anyone has said this, but how does it feel to be comparing the two greatest playoff pitching performances in this decade and they’re both ours!
by Jayson Werth's beard on Oct 8, 2010 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Game Score is a fun toy, but there’s no empirical research behind it. Somebody with stats cred could undoubtedly come up with a better version with better weights. Offhand I would improve it by factoring in extra-base hits.
But even then there’s no way I can imagine to objectively measure the “importance” of Halladay’s no-no against the Reds relative to Lee’s Game 1 against the Yankees.
I have no twitter so I guess the second one. I honestly didn’t even realize that was my handle, I think I made it while I was drunk. And I never really posted before this.
So I am a poser.
by Jayson Werth's beard on Oct 8, 2010 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I hope not. That storyline would be exhausting. I’m just sick of hearing his name. I mean, it never ends. I clicked on Posnanski’s article yesterday to get his take on Roy’s no-no and he has this written:
It’s staggering to think that without too much difficulty, the Phillies could have had Roy Halladay AND Cliff Lee this year. Throw in Cole Hamels, and that’s as good a 1-2-3 pitching combination in memory. If you add Roy Oswalt — though the Phillies might not have traded for Oswalt if they had Lee — it might have been the greatest four-man pitching staff in more than 50 years.
sigh
by Boundforbeach on Oct 8, 2010 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions
And if 1995 Greg Maddux had come back to join the team, just imagine!
by David S. Cohen on Oct 8, 2010 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh, I don’t mean Halladay vs. Lee. I mean maybe Halladay will face the Yankees and pitch another gem.
It would be tough to have a higher GSa since the 2010 Yankees lineup isn’t as good as the 2009 Yankees lineup (not that that’s any fault of Halladay’s, of course). But Lee also had the advantage of being a lefty against that lineup, so maybe that should be factored in.
Gotcha… I thought you meant a WS matchup between the Phils and Rangers (which at this point is at least plausible). Ugh. Every single story would include the obligatory reference that we could have, or should have, kept Cliff Lee.
by Boundforbeach on Oct 8, 2010 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Les
Carpenter came out with an article yesterday talking about how “Halladay Enables Phillies to Forget Lee”. Pure lazy journalism. I’m sure most fans forgot about Lee by May and the only time people think about him is when someone in the media mentions him and how RAJ could have kept him.
It’s fairly annoying really.
by Off_The_Hook on Oct 8, 2010 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
So nothing for a pitcher with 1 rbi and a no hitter….and actual Win in the truest sense of that stat.!
The one thing this analysis doesn’t take into account is the strength of lineups adjusted by year. For instance, the Yankees’ lineup in 2009 had a 122 OPS+, but that’s normalized to the league averages for 2009. 2009 was a higher offensive production year than 2010, so the Reds’ 108 OPS+ in 2010 is even worse compared to the Yankees’ 2009 OPS+ of 122.
I’m also not sure, but I think OPS+ is also normalized by league, not by all of baseball. So, the Yankees’ OPS+ is normalized to the AL, the better hitting league, whereas the Reds’ is normalized to the NL, the weaker hitting league.
Both of these just add to the impressiveness of Lee’s feat.
For the rest of the year, can we just invoke J.K. Rowling and refer to him as “He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named”?
by Boundforbeach on Oct 8, 2010 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions
it seems like the circustamces count by a lot here
if we go by absolutely the greatest pitching performance then it has to go to Halladay
Check it out:
http://joeposnanski.blogspot.com/2010/10/halladay-and-lincecum.html
“But only Halladay — for me, anyway — pitches with what I call “retroactivity.” When Halliday is on, like he was against the Reds, it honestly feels like I’m watching him on replay, in a Ken Burns documentary, like the thing has already happened and it’s already famous like the Thrilla in Manilla or the Texas-USC game. I feel like I’m watching it for the fifth or sixth time."
Not fair...
Not all these games have the same constraints. You give bonus points to the World Series and to the opposing team’s OPS+ difference, but is it fair to do so? Halladay pitched a no-hitter. He couldn’t be much better. Who’s to say that the 2009 Yankees would have gotten a hit off of him. All we know is that nobody on the Red could. Under your guidelines, Halladay had no shot of passing Lee before the game ever started. I am sure Roy isn’t too pleased by that. You can’t blame Halladay for whom he was playing.
For Who? My teammates.
For What? To Win.
How Much? Where do I sign?
I think there’s a way to synthesize all this by drawing a distinction between “which game was a bigger achievement” and “which pitcher pitched better”. The second question is definitely unanswerable, because Halladay wasn’t given the same opportunity that Lee was given. But we can still say Lee’s game was the bigger achievement, if not totally for reasons that were under either guy’s control. That isn’t inconsistent with saying that Halladay might have pitched better than Lee.
Just for argument's sake
What if Halladay’s No-hitter is the first of a series of great games which leads us to another World Series win, with Hamels and Oswalt saying they upped their performances after Halladay inspired them with his debut; while Lee’s game was brilliant, but ultimately we lost the series?
If we’re looking at subjective big picture impact, I think that changes circumstances dramatically.
How about a point for Roy for having already thrown a perfect game earlier in the year? I know it didn’t factor in, but I’m certainly going to remember that every time I think about the playoff no-no. I’m 26 and this is the best year a Phillies pitcher has ever had that I can remember.
All that said, Lee’s one game on top of Doc’s is fine too.
by The Gang Wins the Cup on Oct 8, 2010 12:54 PM EDT reply actions
Might be better to use lineup OPS+ instead of team OPS+. There are a lot of hitters that Lee or Halladay never faced being factored into a statistic for one particular game (if you do this, the 10/28/2009 Yankees come in at 130.6, the 10/6/2010 Reds at 113.4, making your point even more strongly). Similarly, rather than just arbitrarily subtracting points if an AL pitcher must hit, it would be good to figure out what lineup was specifically faced. OPS+ numbers for AL pitchers are probably pretty unreliable, but I’d guess if you used an estimation, it would probably contribute a lot more than -2 (see the Reds on Wednesday losing 4 points of OPS+ from their 8 position players just by including ONE at bat from a pitcher and 2 at bats from pinch hitters). I realize this is probably a lot trickier when you’re looking at a larger set of games like you did, but I think the estimations could be better.
Also, the 5 points for CS or 10 points for WS seem a bit much. To put this in perspective for game score – this is the equivalent of saying the same pitching performance with 2 more earned runs and 1 more unearned run in the WS is the same as one without in a DS. Or 2 less innings pitched. Or… you get the picture. Seems like maybe 3 points and 5 points might better capture the “importance effect” you’re seeking. To add to your subjective-pressure-total, wouldn’t elimination games carry a similar (or greater) import to clinching games?
Overall, I also have the same complaint with the OPS numbers – we are saying there was a difference of 14 points by your count (17 by mine) between the two lineups. We should be clear about what this exactly means in the context of what points are assigned for in game score.
Lastly, I totally agree with TP’s comment from above. “Which pitching performance was better” is probably a poor question to ask, as opposed to “which pitching performance was a bigger accomplishment.”
That said, I prefer to just appreciate both games for being among the most special baseball moments I’ve watched, and not try and argue one as better than the other.
I agree on the 5 & 10. Those seemed unduly steep to me.
Your point about Elimination games – This morning on Mike & Mike they were talking about Larson’s Perfecto vs. Jack Morris’ 10 inning Game 7 shutout. To me that 10 inning shutout is a more important accomplishment because of the all or nothing nature of it. Larson could have given up 10 hits and 5 runs and the Yankees still could have won the series in later games, but if Morris gave up a single run, the Twins would have gone home losers and the Stinkin’ Braves would have been Champs.
wrong.
baseball may be technically about stats, but the BEST thing about it IMO are the intangibles, the karma, the voodoo, mojo, superstitions…does it feel good where you’re sitting, or should you move because they may not win if you stay in that chair?
Lee’s performance last year made us scream and cheer and high five each other, we were sooo lucky to have him.
But there’s just no comparison to the emotion every Phillies fan felt on Wednesday night.. Never once last year did Cliff Lee bring tears to my eyes. He never made me hug strangers. Halladay did. ’Cause even though it was an amazing game -as you say, in the top five – that was only half of it.
God, i love baseball :o)
Yeah, but, to put it simply, Halladay may have made you hug strangers, but he didn’t excel while putting the Phillies a game up in the World Series.
by David S. Cohen on Oct 8, 2010 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions
What about Roy's RBI single?
How come Lee gets credit for his two catches, one of which was so easy he decided to embarrass the Yankees and risk dropping it (Wilson Valdez catches popups the Right Way), but Roy doesn’t get credit for a solid RBI single? Or does that not count because he was so freakin good on the mound he didn’t need his own RBI? How about spending 20 minutes on the basepaths and pitching through 3 innings of rain? There are no-hitters and there are no-hitters. I wuz there and this was a #1 best performance kind of no-hitter.
It is interesting how 2 of the main people defending Halladay here were at the game. This post should in no way diminish how you feel about last night. It is made at the authors discretion with some arbitrary measures based on what the author believes is more important.
Some of the most emotional and excited people on talk radio today and yesterday were at bars or at their friends’ houses. But when you’re at the park, you’re more likely to be paying close attention. That’s one point, and the other is that some of us who went to the game have seen a skillion Phillies games. You wanna know the most emotional moment for me ever at a Phillies game after 35 years of attending games, it was Jimmy’s double last year against the Dodgers in the NLCS. It was a shocking, crazy thrill. Would I say that was the best moment in Philadelphia sports history because that was the most exciting for me? No I would not. Emotion doesn’t equal truth, but neither does it preclude it.
Both games were truly outstanding, but what will I remember more? Roy Halladay’s CG Shutout in game 1. When watching great players, there’s sort of a different feel to it. I felt like, for some reason that Cliff Lee was pitching outta his behind in 2009, that he probably wouldn’t be quite as dominate next year. With Halladay, I expect him to be great. And he himself expects greatness.
Lee’s a great pitcher, Halladay’s the best pitcher in baseball.
by LeQuan Glover on Oct 9, 2010 8:44 PM EDT up reply actions
The funny this is, it’s actually possible to come up with a full list, considering that the Phillies have only played (if my count is right) 86 postseason games in their history.
So I’d guess that Oswalt’s is in the 60s somewhere.
It’s definitely ahead of this one, started by Tommy Greene:
http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/PHI/PHI199310200.shtml
by phillyinportland on Oct 9, 2010 3:53 AM EDT up reply actions
ARGHHHH! Don’t ever do that again, EVER! That game DID NOT HAPPEN!!!!!
When I clicked it, I assumed it was going to be the box for this other Tommy Greene game.
http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/PHI/PHI199310070.shtml
Sorry. For some reason I did not see any of the game you posted, which was why I did not think of it as possibly the worst starting pitcher performance in Phillies history. I did watch the World Series game, and it ranks as the worst Phillies starting pitcher performance that I watched – unless there’s another one that I have blocked out of my memory. (Playoffs only, of course)
by phillyinportland on Oct 9, 2010 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions


































