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Phillies Prospect Roundup: Deadline Day

The MLB Draft process is vastly unlike its counterparts in the other four major sports, and today serves as yet another example of this. While NFL first rounders haggle over bonuses, we all know they're going to sign eventually -- but with baseball, it's very much an open question. The focus of the prospecting world will be on Bryce Harper, Manny Machado and the like, to see whether they even sign and how much of a bonus they get if they do, but every team is working feverishly to get as many draftees signed as possible.

If you're familiar at all with the draft, then you know that the commissioner's office promulgates a recommended slotting system for all draft picks, and prefers teams to hold off on announcing above slot deals until the days leading up to the deadline. This creates a mad rush of signing news in mid-August, as one look at the Fanshots on MLB Bonus Baby will show.

The Phillies have already been active, as MLB Trade Rumors reported last night that the club agreed to deals with 28th round outfielder Brian Pointer for $350K, and 21st round right hander Jonathan Musser for $300K. I'm planning a full draft writeup in the next few days, and I'll address those two in more detail at that point. For now, the focus shifts to 5th rounder Scott Frazier, and I personally hold out some hope for 20th rounder Kevin Walter.

In honor of this joyous occasion, I'm using this week's prospect roundup to highlight bonus babies from years past. Check below the jump to see the Phillies' top four prospects, some toolshed outfielders, and some projectable right handed pitchers.

Star-divide

Domonic Brown, OF-L, Philadelphia: 20th round, 2006, $200K bonus. Dom finally earned his first walk last Wednesday, and was promptly rewarded by being shuttled off to the bench when Shane Victorino returned from the disabled list. Count me in the school of thought that maintains Dom would benefit from everyday at bats for the remainder of the Triple-A season, and can reassume his role as 4th outfielder extraordinaire (in preparation for an everyday job in 2011) when the IronPigs' season ends in early September.

Jarred Cosart, RHP, Lakewood: 38th round, 2008, $550K bonus. Cosart was officially shut down for the season a week-and-a-half back, and the "err on the side of caution" approach is certainly a prudent one in the case of any lingering elbow soreness. That speed bump aside, it's impossible to classify 2010 as anything but a rousing success for the Texas flamethrower, as his 9.7 K/9, 2.0 BB/9, 0.38 HR/9, 55.6% GB and 2.47 FIP highlight what a dominant campaign it was for Cosart. If Dom somehow accumulates 130 at bats this year, Cosart is likely to assume his place as top Phillies prospect in most offseason prospect rankings.

Jonathan Singleton, 1B-L, Lakewood: 8th round, 2009, $200K bonus. It's been a rough second half for the young slugger, as a .239/.341/.350 performance after the All-Star break has dragged his season line down from the stratosphere. Before the pendulum of prospectnik opinion swings too far the other direction, however, consider a few things: (1) even during his slump, he's controlled the strike zone well (12.6% BB, 17.2% K); (2) he's still the subject of glowing scouting reports; and (3) he doesn't turn 19 until next month.

Brody Colvin, RHP, Lakewood: 7th round, 2009, $900K bonus. Colvin was the highest regarded draftee on this list, as he was considered a borderline first round talent who fell to the 7th round only for signability reasons. His first full season of pro ball has been an excellent one, with solid peripherals (8.0 K/9, 2.9 BB/9, 0.52 HR/9, 47.3% GB) adding up to an impressive 3.33 FIP. Colvin might find his way onto some offseason Top 100 lists, making this look like $900,000 well spent by the Phillies.

Jiwan James, OF-S, Lakewood: 22nd round, 2007, $150K bonus. James' second half performance -- he's hit .325/.374/.391 since the All-Star break -- is certainly a positive indicator, but as it's come without great improvement in plate discipline (6.2% BB, 21.3% K) or a power surge (just 10 XBH and a .066 ISO), it shouldn't cause us to revise our assessment all that much. It's just his first full season as a hitter, so James is still understandably raw, but as Mike Newman from Scouting the Sally mentioned in an interview with Phuture Phillies, "the clock continues to tick and he has plenty of catching up to do."

Colby Shreve, RHP, Lakewood: 6th round, 2008, $400K bonus. 2010 has been a success for Shreve in that he's remained healthy after finally getting back onto the field (a full two years after Tommy John surgery forced him to the sidelines). The numbers have, however, been something of a mixed bag. Five no hit innings yesterday lowered Shreve's FIP to 3.69, a number achieved mostly on the basis of solid control (2.5 BB/9); but the strikeout numbers are just okay (6.5 K/9), and he hasn't shown anything approaching extreme ground ball tendencies (39.4% GB). Scouting reports back in April had Shreve's stuff a bit shorter than it had been in his junior college days, so while it seems prudent to wait for updated reports (and to give him year 2 post-TJ to work out the kinks), there are at least some questions about what Shreve's upside is going forward.

Kyrell Hudson, OF-R, Williamsport: 3rd round, 2009, $475 bonus. I'll take the blame for the massive jinx I laid on Hudson by pointing out his 4-to-4 walk-to-strikeout ratio back at the end of June -- the erstwhile Oregon State football recruit has posted a 1-to-30 (!) walk-to-strikeout ratio since then en route to a .193/.223/.229 season line. Game reports have him looking great in center field, but predictably lost at the plate.

Aaron Altherr, OF-R, Williamsport: 9th round, 2009, $150K bonus. Altherr didn't skip a beat after promotion to Williamsport a month ago, going 9-for-27 before missing two weeks after an outfield collision. Altherr's 6-to-26 walk-to-strikeout ratio is a red flag, but he's still managed to hit .310/.344/.401 across two levels. I'll use the rest of this space as a brief opportunity to get on my soapbox. The real difference between Altherr and Hudson is in where they were drafted. Great athletes with limited baseball skills are there to be nabbed later on, as Altherr and Brown and James demonstrate -- but popping them early (as in the case of Hudson or, say, Anthony Hewitt) deprives the club of a chance to select more established talent at that point. It's a general drafting philosophy that I think the Phillies could benefit from: bust slot later to get your toolsheds, and grab more polished players (either college or high school) earlier on.

Steven Inch, RHP, GCL Phillies: 6th round, 2009, $300K bonus. The Canadian right hander was the best high school arm (non-Colvin division) that the Phillies signed last year, but he's sat out all of 2010 with an apparent injury. I liked the brief scouting reports I was able to get my hands on, with Andy Seiler noting that Inch demonstrates "projectability with good pitchability, an excellent combination." Assuming he's able to return to the bump next year, Inch will still only be 20 years old, and he'll have plenty of time to make good on the bonus the organization handed him last year.

Julian Sampson, RHP, Williamsport: 12th round, 2007, $390K bonus. Sampson was the big prize on 2007 deadline day, and had a profile reminiscent of Trevor May's at that point -- i.e. a big Northwest right hander loaded with projection. It's been a struggle for the Washington native, however, as his career 5.33 ERA and middling peripherals (5.1 K/9, 3.2 BB/9) attest. Sent to the bullpen this year in hopes of jump-starting his career, Sampson has managed to get his peripherals in line (27:6 K:BB in 26.0 IP), but he's been hittable (.351 BAA) to an extent that even a .438 BABIP can't fully explain. Value process over result, though -- Sampson's $390,000 bonus was still money well spent for the Phillies. As a wiser fellow than myself once said, sometimes you eat the bear, and sometimes the bear, well, he eats you.

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I had completely forgotten about Inch. Hopefully he’ll be a pleasant surprise next year. There’s a lot of nice talent hanging around on the farm, in a couple years it will be interesting to see after they all make the jump to Double-A who ends up being legit.

by Cormican on Aug 16, 2010 1:56 PM EDT reply actions  

Kelly Dugan was given some props today

Kelly Dugan, OF, Philadelphia Phillies (Rookie-level GCL)
The Phillies’ top pick in 2009 out of a California high school, Dugan is one of those big, raw athletes the Phillies covet — and even though he’s back in the GCL for a second season, the 19-year-old is arguably the hottest hitter in baseball, returning from an injury to go 17-for-26 (.654) in seven GCL games with a nifty 1.585 OPS. A 6-foot-3 switch-hitter with average speed, a good arm and intriguing power potential, he’s just getting going, but should be ready for a full-season assignment in 2011 so the Phillies can figure out what they have here.

by Ant on Aug 16, 2010 2:03 PM EDT reply actions  

Did they ever disclose which part of his body was infected?

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s probably time for Dugan to head back up to Williamsport, but no need to rush it. He is still only 19 years old.

by DannyO on Aug 16, 2010 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

There’s also so little time left in the season, it’s hardly worth it, at this point.

by Cormican on Aug 16, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Looks like there’s gonna be one heckuva logjam in Lakewood outfield next year. I recall we talked about this last year, but looks like it’s materializing one year late.

Let’s assume Hudson stays down in W-port for another year, since he’s struggling so much. That still leaves you with: Dugan, Altherr, Domingo Santana, Zach Collier, Miguel Alvarez, and Gauntlett Eldemire. All guys with legit potential. Gonna be tough to give PT to all of them.

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Even working some in DH, it’s still unmanageable.

by Cormican on Aug 16, 2010 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I guess the idea will be to let them all split time for a couple of months, then promote whoever’s doing the best so that everyone else will have more PT, then lather rinse repeat?

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’d need to look at stats, but could any just stay in Rookie leagues or extended ST next year until promotions make sense from Lakewood.

by Cormican on Aug 16, 2010 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

that could makes sense for Collier, who missed this season, and Eldemire, who doesn’t have a professional AB

maybe then throw Santana into the DH spot, then he doesn’t have to worry about fielding and can maybe improve his plate discipline

http://phightinmathematician.blogspot.com/

by annarborphillie on Aug 16, 2010 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Phis 3B of the Future

Though I agree that the Phillies should not mess with a good thing and Dugan’s hitting is a very good thing.
However, he was a 1B in high school and has a good enough arm for CF. He is obviously a good athlete. Why not try him at 3B? He can always move back to the OF.

by phxphilly on Aug 16, 2010 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Great athletes with limited baseball skills are there to be nabbed later on, as Altherr and Brown and James demonstrate — but popping them early (as in the case of Hudson or, say, Anthony Hewitt) deprives the club of a chance to select more established talent at that point. It’s a general drafting philosophy that I think the Phillies could benefit from: bust slot later to get your toolsheds, and grab more polished players (either college or high school) earlier on.

Preach it, brother. Every draft pick entails risk, but exclusive focus on possible upside—which, in Hewitt’s case, was pretty widely regarded as huge—carries too much in terms of opportunity cost.

Probably there’s a case to be made that when you’re drafting toward the end of the first round, as the Phillies have been and hopefully continue to do for a long time to come, you use that pick on low-risk likely contributors, and take your huge shots and pay above-slot bonuses later on.

by dajafi on Aug 16, 2010 2:03 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m okay with the occasional early lottery pick. I depends upon who’s available for one thing. If it’s late first round and the best talent on the board has the floor of Kyle Kendrick and the ceiling of Joe Blanton, but there’s a lottery card available who has a ceiling of Ken Griffey Jr. and a floor of . I take the lottery card.

by Cormican on Aug 16, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I didn’t like the Hewitt pick, but it was mitigated by the fact that they had six early picks that year, so they could afford to take shots downfield.

Gose and Knapp have already paid off in terms of trade return, and Vance Worley and Jonathan Pettibone are pretty decent prospects. And the jury’s still out on the other kid, Collier, too, since he’s been hurt.

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

I guess the corollary to my above soapbox rant is my general philosophical preference for early round picks to have exhibited some modicum of current skills (specifically, I’m thinking pitch recognition). It’s why I liked the Collier pick at the time, but disliked the Hewitt and Gose picks — the latter two had serious questions about their ability to make contact (though Gose obviously far outstripped my expectations on that front).

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I take the point overall, but Worley was more like the kind of guy I meant—college pitcher, not huge stuff but with a clue on the mound. They’ve done a lot of that over the last few years with guys like Happ and Carpenter.

Not every team can do that, but for a large-market club that make the occasional foray into free agency or the high-end trade market, I think there’s a lot to be said for looking to fill out middle of the roster with high-probability high-round picks.

by dajafi on Aug 16, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, I didn’t mean to suggest that Worley was a high-risk/high-ceiling pick. But the fact that they had so many picks that year had two benefits: First, they were able to take multiple high-risk/high-ceiling guys, thus giving them “more shots downfield.” And second, they were able to mix in a low-risk/moderate-ceiling guy in there too, as a sort of hedge.

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, I didn’t mean to suggest that Worley was a high-risk/high-ceiling pick. But the fact that they had so many picks that year had two benefits: First, they were able to take multiple high-risk/high-ceiling guys, thus giving them “more shots downfield.” And second, they were able to mix in a low-risk/moderate-ceiling guy in there too, as a sort of hedge.

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, I didn’t mean to suggest that Worley was a high-risk/high-ceiling pick. But the fact that they had so many picks that year had two benefits: First, they were able to take multiple high-risk/high-ceiling guys, thus giving them “more shots downfield.” And second, they were able to mix in a low-risk/moderate-ceiling guy in there too, as a sort of hedge.

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ladies and gentlemen, the eighth wonder of the world, the unassisted triple post.

Honor is no substitute for victory.

by The Dark on Aug 16, 2010 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I can finally start calling Taco Pal “Beardo”

by Cormican on Aug 16, 2010 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Holy crap. How did that happen?

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

What can you send to the TGP “Hall of Fame”?

Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.

by doubleh on Aug 16, 2010 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

the Esc key from his keyboard

by Wet Luzinski on Aug 16, 2010 8:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

But we needed time to commiserate with Cole Hamels about his unluckiness, didn’t we?

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

No – I was referring to Hudson’s walk to strikeout ratio!

by David S. Cohen on Aug 16, 2010 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

LOL. I also thought you were being all professorial.

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

I literally did laugh out loud.

But to address your actual point… nope, that’s not a good ratio. It makes me wonder how he ever managed those 4 walks in his first 6 games.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Blind squirrel: Nut or really bad pitches taken- (think a series of walks against pitchers who have absolutely no connection to the strike zone?

by dannijd on Aug 16, 2010 4:14 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

was Romero rehabbing that week?

by Philibuster on Aug 16, 2010 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Awesome. I really, really like Walter’s profile — he’s probably my favorite player in this draft class aside from Biddle.

Not really holding out hope on Frazier at this point, but if his rumored bonus demands are accurate, I don’t actually mind signing Walter, Pointer and Musser instead (if this came down to something of an either/or situation within the budget).

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

What do you think should be Ruben’s bottom line on Frazier? No higher than Colvin?

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly what my thoughts were. No higher than Colvin.

Looking forward to the Kevin Kolb era.
5-8-10...the day the Purdue Boilermakers basketball team won the 2011 NCAA Championship!!

by EREX21 on Aug 16, 2010 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I definitely wouldn’t go higher than Colvin. Colvin got sandwich round money last year because that was his consensus talent level; BA had him #43 overall, for instance. For comparison’s sake, BA has Frazier at #85 overall, and the estimated bonus for that slot in the draft this year is $417K. Wild guess here, but I’d venture that the Phillies probably don’t want to go much above $600K to $700K for Frazier — and if he wasn’t going to sign for that amount, then it’s very possible that they used that money to bump up the offers to the other three.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

i don’t know much about Frazier, but from what I gather he has a similar ceiling to Colvin but with his mechanics and lack of velocity is a little bit more of a risk. does this seem like a fair assessment? by that logic $600K to $700K seems fair.

http://phightinmathematician.blogspot.com/

by annarborphillie on Aug 16, 2010 7:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s pretty fair. It’s more the mechanics and not the velocity that are the problem; at his size, with funky mechanics, he has some problems repeating his delivery, which leads to inconsistent results. Andy Seiler summed up by saying that he’ll “need a more lengthy re-work than most high-level prep pitchers,” but that his upside is nonetheless substantial.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

didn’t Cosart have a pause in his delivery like Aaron Cook and they improved that relatively quickly. that gives me some confidence they would be able to work with Frazier

http://phightinmathematician.blogspot.com/

by annarborphillie on Aug 16, 2010 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Tall pitchers (Frazier is 6’7") frequently have problems with repeatable mechanics and it’s usually not an overnight fix. He could get them fixed in a few years and be great. Frazier can supposedly touch 96 with his fastball and his size makes him really projectable. I like Frazier, but agree with PF that it’s not worth breaking the bank for.

by Cormican on Aug 16, 2010 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

They don’t- per Matt Gelb the parties will not reach an agreement before the deadline.

by dannijd on Aug 16, 2010 10:52 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

OT: K-Rod might need surgery

http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/news/story?id=5468863

Looking forward to the Kevin Kolb era.
5-8-10...the day the Purdue Boilermakers basketball team won the 2011 NCAA Championship!!

by EREX21 on Aug 16, 2010 6:11 PM EDT reply actions  

Any idea how long he’s out for?

by chase8008 on Aug 16, 2010 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m hearing possibly the season.

Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.

by doubleh on Aug 16, 2010 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Furthermore the Mets may try to void his contract.

by Cormican on Aug 16, 2010 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wouldn’t blame them- not only did he commit a criminal act on their grounds, but this act caused him an injury that may take him out for the season- why should they keep him around? If I were the Wilpons I would be trying to either void the contract or at least find a way to not have to pay him while he is on the DL with this injury.

by dannijd on Aug 16, 2010 10:55 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Dodgers with an early 1-0 lead.

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 7:52 PM EDT reply actions  

playing in hilariously bad slop.

by Wet Luzinski on Aug 16, 2010 8:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Leadoff triple by Infante in the 6th.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

And Ethier just took away a HR just about.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Braves just tied it up for those interested

by chase8008 on Aug 16, 2010 9:09 PM EDT reply actions  

Conrad just lost a ball to start the 8th, man on first and no outs.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

In other news

Cliff Lee and David Price faced off in Tampa, and Price gave up 5BB’s in 6IP, or in other words, he gave up half of Lee’s season total in one start. How exactly is Lee below this guy in the Cy Young race? (At least from articles from voters I’ve seen)

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 9:24 PM EDT reply actions  

2008

Because David Price single-handedly won the World Series for the Rays in 2008, you silly goose!

http://www.thegoodphight.com

by WholeCamels on Aug 16, 2010 9:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Huh

I guess that’s why I’ve been hearing all this Brad Lidge for MVP talk.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rays get 4 runs off Lee in the 8th

Lee’s line: 7.2 IP, 9 H, 6 ER, 1 BB, 10 SO

by schmenkman on Aug 16, 2010 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Only a 10.0 K/BB ratio for Lee, bringing down his overall numbers.
I was watching some of it, Lee got blooped to death in the 8th.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, he got BABIP-slapped

by Cormican on Aug 17, 2010 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

Plus a terrible decision by the 2B.

by essman on Aug 17, 2010 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Stupid Dodgers lineup. Score you idiots! What’s wrong with you?

by taco pal on Aug 16, 2010 9:37 PM EDT reply actions  

See, men on first and second now.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 9:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ha ha! 2 runs score! Conrad makes his second error of the inning. Then Heyward makes an error in the first base area. Wow.
That’s two runs on a walk and three errors.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 9:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dodgers

according to their broadcast are 0-20 with RISP for the series.
And they may take two of four.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also, man on 3rd with no outs

by chase8008 on Aug 16, 2010 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ethier should’ve just figured out that there will be no defense this inning and put the ball in play. A strikeout pretty much prevents that.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Theriot ran about as fast as Bengie Molina there. Out by a mile.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 9:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

On topic post

Apparently, the phillies will not reach an agreement with Scott Frazier.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 9:54 PM EDT reply actions  

yup

Oh well.

http://www.thegoodphight.com

by WholeCamels on Aug 16, 2010 10:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well at least we know the money that could’ve gone to him was well invested. Right, Danys Baez?

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Kuo

is close to giving this back to the Braves. No outs, two men on.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:09 PM EDT reply actions  

And a wild pitch. Wonderful.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

And they’re loaded with one out…

by PSUFlyers on Aug 16, 2010 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not even his fault. Gonzalez with a Chip Caray special to left, then McCann pulled one right where Loney should have been (why are you holding a man on first in a 2-run game with a dead pull hitter at the plate, Mr. Torre?), then Ausmus belies his reputation as a stellar defensive catcher by letting a fastball right through the wickets.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 10:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Dodgers are, and always will be, gutless turds.

http://www.thegoodphight.com

by WholeCamels on Aug 16, 2010 10:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe they were serious about hating us — and throwing this series to the Braves to keep us out of the playoffs.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

And now the umpire isn’t even giving him pitches. Ball 3 was right in the middle of the plate. At least I don’t have to watch Brooks fucking Conrad hit a walk off HR.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Now Dotel on. Just thank God it’s not a 1-run game, because I’m pretty confident he’ll walk a run in here.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Or a ball will go to Casey Blake, easy double play, and it’ll go straight through his legs?

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

why did you have to call it?

by Ant on Aug 16, 2010 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wish I was wrong, if it’s any consolation.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Think he’ll make it two in a row?

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

There’s your free run on the BB.

by PSUFlyers on Aug 16, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dodgers attempting to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory

by FearTheTurtIe on Aug 16, 2010 10:23 PM EDT reply actions  

WTF ()@@#$(%@!!!!

This team is damn lucky lately

by Ant on Aug 16, 2010 10:23 PM EDT reply actions  

That left fielder needs to be benched for the remainder of the season.

by Ant on Aug 16, 2010 10:24 PM EDT reply actions  

He was never throwing out the runner at home anyway.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I still need to make it feel less painful

by Ant on Aug 16, 2010 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bullshit. I mean sure we came back from a seven run defecit but I don’t care they shoulda won this.

by FearTheTurtIe on Aug 16, 2010 10:25 PM EDT reply actions  

F you, too, Dodgers.

Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.

by doubleh on Aug 16, 2010 10:25 PM EDT reply actions  

Wow

LA announcer just said, “And the Dodgers just can’t seem to catch a break.”

by essman on Aug 16, 2010 10:25 PM EDT reply actions  

LOL. F you, Dodger announcers. Your team blows.

by PSUFlyers on Aug 16, 2010 10:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

So does this double Kuo’s ERA for the year?

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes. It jumped from 0.86 to ~1.5

by PSUFlyers on Aug 16, 2010 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

They obviously should’ve sewn that one up, but there’s a hint of truth to what he’s saying. That inning went: bloop single; ground ball to (where the) first baseman (should’ve been playing if Torre wasn’t retarded); wild pitch; walk; ground ball to (where the) shortstop (would’ve been if he wasn’t cheating for the DP).

None of those balls were hit well, but I guess good teams make their own breaks — hell, the Phillies have made a living off of crap like that since 2007.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 16, 2010 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I am mad salty right now

by FearTheTurtIe on Aug 16, 2010 10:26 PM EDT reply actions  

I guess I can’t be too mad about the Dodgers’ tendency to implode considering what happened last week, but still… sack the eff up and win a game, guys.

by zfg on Aug 16, 2010 10:27 PM EDT reply actions  

And the Dodgers finish their series with the Braves with 5 runs scored, having gone 0-20 with RISP.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s like they’re inventing new ways to lose at this point.

Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.

by doubleh on Aug 16, 2010 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Apparently Kuo has a bit of Ryan Madson syndrome in him. He burned through the 8th inning on 7 pitches… then have jack shit left for the 9th inning. Once he comes back to the dugout and cools off the arm, his night should be over.

by PSUFlyers on Aug 16, 2010 10:29 PM EDT reply actions  

Two inning saves are pretty much limited to Rivera. Other than him, no one else does it.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Anymore

http://www.thegoodphight.com

by WholeCamels on Aug 16, 2010 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

I thought K-Rod had a few this year? I know he got the last four outs against the Phillies in Santana’s last start against them.

by dannijd on Aug 16, 2010 11:01 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Full two inning ones, at least.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Statistical curiosity

MLB lists a hold for Kuo (presumably for the 8th inning) and then the loss. Dotel was credited with a blown save. Shouldn’t Kuo also be credited with a blown save? And if so, how can he also get a hold?

by PSUFlyers on Aug 16, 2010 10:32 PM EDT reply actions  

The blown save only goes to the guy who is in the game when the lead is lost.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fair enough. But then how does Kuo simultaneously get a hold and the loss? He didn’t exactly hold the lead if he gave it up.

by PSUFlyers on Aug 16, 2010 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

That one I’m not so sure on. All the runs scored were Kuo’s fault, so that might be how it was determined. I say Torre gets the loss if the scorer was fair.

by philsandthrills on Aug 16, 2010 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

The simple answer is that wins, losses, saves and holds are goddamned stupid stats.

by phatj on Aug 16, 2010 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is something that I think we can all heartily agree with; I was just asking the question because I thought it was odd. I’ve never really paid attention to the “hold” stat so I was curious and figured that this was a good chance to ask the question. This particular game situation is the perfect example why these statistics are so meaningless.

by PSUFlyers on Aug 17, 2010 8:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yup. My only interest in these stats is in how they are perceived by GMs and agents and thus how they affect pitcher salaries. Likewise RBIs for hitters.

by phatj on Aug 17, 2010 7:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

The lead still existed while Kuo was in the game, so the criteria for “earning” a hold apply. And those criteria (entering a game in a save situation, recording at least one out) do make it possible to earn a hold and lose the game after you’ve left. It’s a dumb (probably unforeseen) consequence of the confluence of two stats.

by essman on Aug 16, 2010 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

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