The Accidental Genius of Charles F. Manuel
If there is anything we know about Charlie Manuel, it is that he stubbornly refuses to deviate from the received wisdom of bullpen management. During Proven Closer(TM) Brad Lidge's frequent struggles in 2009 and occasional struggles this season, Manuel has been steadfast in his support of Lidge. "He's my guy," Manuel replied to the angry hoards of fans (rightly) calling for Lidge to be removed as closer. Roughly translated, this means "I will continue to use Brad Lidge in close, late game situations despite the availability of better options." And indeed, Lidge has remained the Phillies' closer. To his credit, however, in the 16.1 innings since his ghastly blown save against the Nationals on July 31st, he has been absolutely dominant, recording 11 saves against 1 blown save, allowing only 2 runs on 7 hits, and striking out 18 while walking just 3 (though it is worth pointing out that over this span he has an unsustainably low .184 BABIP).
SABR-slanted fans have long challenged the bullpen management commonsense of major league coaches. Rather than designating a "closer" to earn "saves" by pitching almost exclusively in the 9th inning of games in which the team is leading by 3 or fewer runs, they advocate using the team's best reliever to pitch in the highest leverage situations or against the opposing team's best hitters. In the case of the Phillies, Ryan Madson has been, without a doubt, the best reliever on the team. In fact, Madson has been even better than his 2.83 ERA suggests, with a FIP/xFIP line of 2.18/2.46. Yes, believe it or not, Madson's .331 BABIP suggests that he has been a bit unlucky on balls in play this season. Perhaps most impressive to me is his eye-popping 11.32 K/9 and his miniscule 1.31 BB/9. But wait, there's more! Since his July 8th return from the DL after being attacked by a chair, he has been even better: 32.1 IP, 22 H, 7 R, 6 ER, 3 BB, 42 K, 1.67 ERA (prior to last night's appearance). If anyone on the Phillies is an ace reliever, it is Ryan Madson. Of course, with Lidge the apparent closer for life under the Manuel regime, Madson remains firmly entrenched in the setup role.
If one peers a bit deeper into the performance of the Phillies bullpen over the past month--in particular the combination of Madson and Lidge--one will notice something strange afoot. While it would probably be giving Charlie Manuel too much credit to suggest it has been by design, in the games in which Madson has set up Lidge, Madson has done a great deal of the dirty work. In other words, Madson has faced better hitters than Lidge has, thereby making Lidge's job in the 9th inning easier. After the jump I have posted the play-by-play of games since August 1st (I know this is a somewhat arbitrary cutoff, but it marks the beginning of Lidge's current streak) in which Madson and Lidge have pitched back-to-back innings. Players' pre-game OPSes are in parentheses.
August 4, @ Marlins:
Bottom 8th
- R. Madson relieved J. Contreras
- G. Sanchez (.804 OPS) doubled to deep left center
- D. Uggla (.881) walked
- C. Ross (.740) flied out to deep left center, G. Sanchez to third, D. Uggla to second
- M. Stanton (.784) struck out swinging
- W. Helms (.715) struck out swinging
Bottom 9th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- R. Paulino (.698) struck out looking
- D. Murphy hit for L. Nunez
- D. Murphy (Career .659 OPS) grounded out to third
- H. Ramirez (.799) flied out to center
Advantage: Madson
August 5, @ Marlins:
Bottom 9th
- R. Madson relieved D. Baez
- H. Ramirez (.799) hit by pitch
- L. Morrison (.621) struck out swinging, H. Ramirez stole second
- G. Sanchez (.821) struck out swinging
- D. Uggla (.881) intentionally walked
- C. Ross (.733) struck out swinging
Bottom 10th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- M. Stanton (.795) singled to shallow left
- W. Helms (.696) struck out swinging, M. Stanton stole second
- B. Hayes (Career .694) struck out swinging
- E. Bonifacio hit for W. Ohman
- E. Bonifacio (.636) flied out to right
Advantage: Madson
August 8, vs. Mets:
Top 8th
- R. Madson relieved R. Halladay
- D. Wright (.869) flied out to left
- I. Davis (.767) flied out to shallow left
- F. Martinez (Career .505) struck out swinging
Top 9th
- J. Reyes (.727) flied out to deep center
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- J. Thole (.759) singled to shallow center
- R. Tejada (.528) grounded out to first, J. Thole to second
- C. Carter (Career .683) grounded out to first, J. Thole to third
Advantage: Madson
August 11, vs. Dodgers
Top 8th
- R. Madson relieved R. Oswalt
- S. Podsednik (.730) doubled to deep left
- R. Theriot (.650) struck out looking
- A. Ethier (.895) struck out swinging
- J. Loney (.763) flied out to shallow left
Top 9th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- C. Blake (.737) grounded out to shortstop
- J. Gibbons (Career .770) struck out swinging
- J. Carroll (.691) struck out swinging
Advantage: Madson
August 15, @ Mets
Bottom 8th
- M. Sweeney at first
- R. Madson relieved C. Durbin
- J. Reyes (.726) popped out to shortstop
- A. Pagan (.832) struck out swinging
- D. Wright (.845) walked
- C. Beltran struck (.645) out swinging
Bottom 9th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- I. Davis (.751) struck out swinging
- C. Carter (Career .683) flied out to right
- J. Thole (.812) flied out to center
Advantage Madson
August 20, vs. Nationals
Top 8th
- R. Madson relieved R. Halladay
- R. Bernadina (.734) singled to right
- M. Morse (.841) grounded out to second, R. Bernadina to second
- I. Rodriguez (.645) struck out swinging
- A. Kennedy (.671) grounded out to shortstop
Top 9th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- W. Harris hit for D. Slaten
- W. Harris (.621) lined out to right center
- N. Morgan (.646) flied out to deep left center
- I. Desmond (.719) doubled to left
- A. Dunn (.910) struck out swinging
Advantage: Lidge
August 28, @ San Diego
Bottom 8th
- R. Madson relieved J. Contreras
- E. Cabrera hit for E. Mujica
- E. Cabrera (Career .655) grounded out to shortstop
- D. Eckstein (.687) flied out to center
- M. Tejada (.692) struck out swinging
Bottom 9th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- A. Gonzalez (.908) struck out looking
- R. Ludwick (.797) popped out to shallow left center
- C. Headley (.738) flied out to left
Advantage: Lidge
August 31, @ Los Angeles
Bottom 8th
- R. Madson relieved J.C. Romero
- M. Kemp (.757) flied out to left center
- J. Loney (.725) struck out swinging
- C. Blake (.753) lined out to pitcher
Bottom 9th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- R. Belliard (.641) grounded out to shortstop
- R. Barajas (.737) flied out to right
- J. Gibbons hit for O. Dotel
- J. Gibbons (Career .770) grounded out to second
Advantage: Madson
September 1, @ Los Angeles
Bottom 8th
- R. Madson relieved J.C. Romero
- J. Carroll (.717) singled to shallow center
- A. Ethier (.866) flied out to center
- M. Kemp (.759) safe at first on shortstop J. Rollins' fielding error, J. Carroll to second
- J. Loney (.732) singled to deep right, J. Carroll scored, M. Kemp to second
- C. Blake (.746) grounded into double play shortstop to first, J. Loney out at second
Bottom 9th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- J. Gibbons hit for H. Kuo
- J. Gibbons (Career .770) flied out to shallow right
- R. Barajas (.734) struck out looking
- R. Theriot (.671) walked
- S. Podsednik (.737) struck out swinging
Advantage: Madson
September 4th, vs. Brewers
Top 8th
- J.C. Romero relieved R. Halladay
- P. Fielder (.890) grounded out to second
- R. Madson relieved J.C. Romero
- C. McGehee (.812) flied out to shallow left center
- C. Dickerson (Career .770) struck out swinging
Top 9th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- A. Escobar (.641) grounded out to third
- M. Gamel hit for J. Lucroy
- M. Gamel (Career .760) struck out looking
- G. Kottaras hit for C. Villanueva
- G. Kottaras (.731) flied out to deep center
Advantage: Romero+Madson
September 6th, vs. Marlins
Top 8th
- J.C. Romero relieved R. Oswalt
- L. Morrison (.892) walked
- R. Madson relieved J.C. Romero
- H. Ramirez (.868) lined out to left center
- D. Uggla (.875) struck out swinging
- C. Tracy (Career .785) grounded out to third
Top 9th
- B. Lidge relieved R. Madson
- W. Helms (.688) struck out looking
- M. Stanton (.795) popped out to left center
- E. Bonifacio hit for M. Rivera
- E. Bonifacio (.685) singled to shallow right
- E. Bonifacio to second on fielder's indifference
- S. Cousins (Career .789 Minor League OPS) struck out swinging
Advantage: Romero+Madson
While clearly not intentional, Charlie Manuel has done a good job managing the back end of his bullpen recently, generally using his best reliever (Madson) against the opposing team's best hitters. In 9 of the 11 games listed above, Madson has faced better hitters than Lidge has. Surely this has simply been because the meat of the opposing team's lineup has just happened to bat in the 8th inning, but sometimes it really is better to be lucky than good.
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This definitely seems to be by accident, which you note. I would be interested in seeing the numbers when Lidge was struggling and if it was because he was facing the stronger hitters as they were coming up in the 9th instead of the 8th.
Yeah, I wish I could have expanded it a bit (and I’d welcome any addenda) but just going through the game-by-game OPSes and what-not was hecka time consuming. I’m wondering if anyone has any better ways of doing this kind of thing.
Pessimism of the intellect, optimism of the will.
Great analysis. Very interesting.
I guess one of the morals to the story is that if having a set-in-stone “closer role” is silly (which it is), then it can’t be an outrage to designate the “wrong” guy for that role. As long as your best two relievers are always pitching in every game, then it doesn’t matter what order you put them in.
The best methodology, of course, would be to always throw the better of the two guys against the better group of hitters. But assuming you aren’t going to do that (since nobody does), then whether the better guy is the “closer” or the “set-up man” doesn’t matter.
Extend that principle even further, and you’d say that the leverage of the situation should dictate which reliever pitches at which time, all the way down through the bullpen. In that vein, check out the leverage measures for this season (via BP).
A far cry from the hand-wringing of last year, I’ll tell you that. The clear cut top three relievers are pitching the highest leverage situations, followed by the fourth best reliever and the (still not-on-track) LOOGY. And for all the Baez complaints, he’s been successfully marginalized by Charlie.
I should add that I can’t get splits of those leverage measures, FM, or I’d have run them for August and September, because while Lidge is “leading” in leverage over the course of the season, I suspect Madson might be leading over the stretch you’ve highlighted. Great stuff here.
Thanks man. Yeah, I tried to go through the fangraphs leverage index data, but must admit I’m a bit ignorant of how some of that stuff works.
Pessimism of the intellect, optimism of the will.
Do you (by you, I mean you, the reader, not necessarily the writer) think that abolishing the save statistic would change the way bullpens are handled? Managers can easily point to the save statistic and say that’s why he is our closer. If saves were never mentioned, would managers change how they use relievers based on something else or would they continue to designate matchup guys, 8th inning guy, 9th inning guy?
Hi.
Since there are a lot of Phils fans visiting our slice of the intertubes, I thought I’d venture over here, and see what’s up in Philly-land. This has been one of my favorite topics for a while now, and if you don’t mind, here’s my take on it.
In short, get rid of singular saves and holds, and replace them with save and hold innings; measured by how many outs under certain circumstances are converted. Best way to explain it, is example.
• Phillies down 1-2 in the 6th inning, and Blanton is knocked out of the game after pitching 5.2 IP. Jose Contreras is brought in while there are runners on 2nd and 3rd, and completes the inning with no damage. He is now credited with 0.1 held IP, for keeping the score within 1-run.
• Phillies then tie the game 2-2 in the bottom of the 6th, and in the 7th, Danys Baez is called in, and pitches a scoreless frame, and is credited with 1.0 held IP for keeping the game in check.
• Phillies take one-run lead in bottom of 7th. Baez left in to pitch 8th (yes, I’m aware that’s not very logical but for the sake of explanation), and gets one out, but then gets in trouble, and suddenly there’s a single and double, runners on 2nd/3rd, 1 out. Madson is called in, gets two strikeouts. He is credited with 0.2 save IP, for quite literally saving the lead, under the circumstances.
• Brad Lidge protects the 1-run lead, and despite the two frustrating walks (had to get my ribbing in in here), converts 1.0 save IP.
I wrote this giant idea proposal last year on our site, and I’m aware of the holes and inefficiencies that still exist, but the rationale is simple: relief pitchers need stats like holds and saves to justify their earnings, and getting rid of them altogether would be outright unfair. As statistically obsessed we internet nerds may be, arbiters, and still a lot of FO people aren’t looking at FIP, platoon splits, WHIP, WPA, or any other advanced metrics, and will undervalue middle-relief, despite how important they are in modern baseball. My theory supposedly floats a little more value to middle relievers, without destroying the late-inning guys’ stat padding. And would very likely eliminate the scenarios of “can’t bring in the closer in the 7th because it’s not the 9th.”
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
Nice write up. I agree that relievers need stats to show that they are worth money. I also think this is part of the reason why closers always pitch in the 9th, since they often make the most in the bullpen and were theoretically signed to pitch in the 9th, so the manager feels compelled to pitch them in the 9th.
So in your proposal, you can get a SIP in any inning as long as the tying run is on base, credited to someone else? So if a team is up 4-3 in the 7th, SP gives up a walk and reliever comes in to close out the 7th, that is 1.0 SIP?
Definitely an interesting concept, thanks for sharing.
The one obvious idiosyncrasy I see is that Baez could get .2 innings of a save and Madson could come in the next inning, blow the lead and get the W. I liked the idea at first blush, but the more I think about it, the more I worry it would be releasing cobras in your bedroom to get rid of your mouse problem, so to speak.
I'll admit
It was pretty black and white when I conjured it up, and I can’t really say I factored in the vulture win aspect, but I see your concerns. Obviously, I’m not worried that this methodology would ever come to fruition, but if it ever did, I’m sure many people way smarter than me would iron it all out before integrating it.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
In that scenario, the reliever would get 1.0 HIP, or it could turn into a situation where if the base-runner stole or advanced on a grounder, the reliever could be relieved and then the next pitcher could earn SIPs since the base-runner was now in scoring position with a one-run lead.
No wonder nobody likes you, Tuttle... everything's a (Pujols) damn debate.
By the way, Hanley has the day off today. Sore from getting HBP’d Monday afternoon. Nice going Zagurski!
To me it says more about one of the reasons for Lidge’s recent success – he’s not facing the best hitters in his recent save situations. I don’t think it says ANYTHING about strategy, since Manuel has no control over where the other team is in the batting order come the 9th inning.
I agree with your second sentence about control, but there is some strategy involved when Romero is brought in to face a lefty to start the 8th inning. But how do you come to the conclusion that Lidge’s recent success is because he’s not facing the best hitters? Do you know that he would be less successful against other hitters? Why be negative about Lidge at this point? About the only thing FM said that indicated Lidge did less than brilliant work was the comment about the blown save against the Nationals, and that came against a very good hitter, Ryan Zimmerman, a guy with numerous walkoff homers. Making Lidge’s job easier in the 9th is Madson’s job in the 8th inning. Just because Madson does his job well doesn’t mean Lidge has an easy time of it. Be thankful when both pitchers do well.
by phillyinportland on Sep 9, 2010 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions

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