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Yes, I'm the person who gave Raul Ibanez a 10th place vote for SB Nation NL MVP

No, I'm not his mother or father. As far as I am aware, we share no recent ancestors. I've been reading the reaction to this admittedly peculiar choice, and I feel like I owe an explanation.

Next week, the BBWAA will reveal the winner of the 2011 NL MVP. If SB Nation's own voting for the award is any indication, Matt Kemp should win by a comfortable margin.

Rank Name 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th 9th 10th Total
1 Matt Kemp 21 5 1 1 353
2 Ryan Braun 7 19 2 285
3 Joey Votto 8 7 6 3 4 176
4 Justin Upton 1 7 3 3 5 1 3 1 140
5 Prince Fielder 2 3 4 2 1 5 1 4 1 119
6 Troy Tulowitzki 3 1 3 5 7 3 2 91
7 Jose Reyes 1 2 5 7 3 1 3 86
8 Roy Halladay 1 5 3 1 1 1 1 85
9 Clayton Kershaw 2 2 2 1 1 1 1 56
10 Albert Pujols 1 3 2 2 1 1 3 51
11 Lance Berkman 1 2 2 3 2 2 44
12 Shane Victorino 1 1 1 3 1 3 2 41
13 Cliff Lee 3 1 1 3 33
14 Andrew McCutchen 1 1 3 2 3 26
15 Pablo Sandoval 2 1 1 19
16 Brandon Phillips 2 1 1 2 17
17 Matt Holliday 2 1 12
18 Michael Morse 1 2 5
19 Carlos Beltran 1 4
19 Mike Stanton 1 2 4
21 Ryan Roberts 2 2
22 Ian Kennedy 1 1
22 Hunter Pence 1 1
22 Raul Ibanez 1 1

Kemp was awesome this year, and it's hard to dispute that he deserved the award. Kemp had plenty to offer both traditionalists--he took two of the three triple crown categories with 39 homers and 126 RBI (with a not too shabby .324 BA and 40 stolen bases to boot)--and the saber-inclined, with a .419 wOBA and 8.7 fWAR. Indeed, I would argue that outside of a top three of Kemp, Halladay (8.2 fWAR), and Ryan Braun (7.8 fWAR), a good case could be made for any arrangement of players for the next seven spots. 

Here is my full ballot: 

Star-divide

1. Kemp 2. Halladay 3. Braun 4. Votto 5. Victorino 6. Upton 7. Kershaw 8. Tulowitzki 9. Stanton 10. Ibanez

Unless you are firmly against the idea of pitchers winning the MVP, I'd say that you'd have a hard time taking issue with any of my first eight picks. If you look at FanGraphs' NL WAR leaderboard* you will see that after Kemp, Halladay, and Braun, there are eight players who fell between 6.9 and 5.9. Beyond that, there are another 10 or so players for whom you could make a reasonable argument in support of their worthiness of downballot consideration. 

*And I fully acknowledge the limitations of WAR, but it is useful for getting at least a general sense of how good a player was in relation to his peers. 

This reveals what I believe is the central problem with MVP voting. The very notion of voting for the "most valuable player" seems fundamentally contradictory. Voting is an inherently subjective act, while "value" is something we should strive to know with as much objective certainty as possible. If we are going to vote on something called the "Most Valuable Player Award," it would only make sense that every voter was using the same rubric. But then, if we are using the same rubric, what would be the point of voting at all? The "value" of one player relative another shouldn't be put up to a vote any more than the value of nickel relative to a dime should be put up to a vote. You could take the best metric of value we currently have at our disposal and make the leader the MVP winner. However, this would ostensibly sit well with neither saber-oriented voters who would dispute just which value metric is the most useful, nor traditionalist voters who reject the very concept of value metrics for fear that WAR, VORP, and WARP will render them irrelevant. 

So, the BBWAA must acknowledge once and for all the irreconcilability of the voting process with the concept of value by renaming the MVP award to reflect that it is ultimately a subjective honor. Call it the Most Awesome Player award. Or, the Player Who Had a Really Good Year (Like a Bunch of Other Players) Who This Voter Really Liked For Whatever Reason Award. If we dispensed with all of the illusions about just what the award represented, it would spare us from these annual pedantic debates whenever someone makes a weird vote. I think most people already recognize that the MVP vote rarely gives an accurate accounting of who the most valuable players are. The fact that it is called the MVP, though, nevertheless results in confusion. 

Of course, I still believe we should be working to improve the accuracy of our value metrics and the best one should eventually form the basis of a "True MVP Award." In the meantime, if the name of the MVP award actually reflected what it represents, it would save us a lot of outrage when an undeserving player places too high and a deserving player places too low.

Now, all of this is only tenuously connected to my decision to give Ibanez a vote, I admit. When I threw Raul Ibanez that 10th place vote, I did so primarily as a joke. I am fully aware that Ibanez was really, really bad this year--one of the worst players in the National League, as a matter of fact. I thought it would be a funny way to acknowledge how awful he was by giving him a last place vote so he would appear at the bottom of the results. I also knew that one joke of a 10th place vote wouldn't have any appreciable impact on the outcome, so I figured it would be worth the LULz. If the rest of the ballot is defensible, I don't think a single troll vote is that big of a deal. But in addition, I think that the vote underscores the contradiction between what the name of the award implies and the process through which it is awarded by taking subjectivity to the most absurd lengths.

Now I realize that giving Ibanez a vote has also allowed me to clarify my thoughts on the MVP award and pin down precisely what it is about the award that has bugged me for so long. I hope it's allowed you to do the same.

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SB Nation NL MVP voting: srs bsns

Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Nov 18, 2011 10:06 PM EST reply actions  

I find it interesting that the SB Nation Cy Young award was a tie between Kershaw and Halladay, yet in their MVP voting Halladay handily trounces Kershaw.

by 88Lindros88 on Nov 18, 2011 11:04 PM EST reply actions  

I found that kind of odd myself. It leads credence to the article though. Roy Halladay is undeniably a more popular player than Kershaw is now.

by Mattypmp on Nov 18, 2011 11:22 PM EST up reply actions  

this list is pretty interesting

The Jruth shall be told.

by packimop on Nov 18, 2011 11:15 PM EST reply actions  

Who was the Pence vote?

"You play to win the playoffs, and we let 'em off the hook!" -Herm Mora Green

by jrobulls on Nov 18, 2011 11:37 PM EST reply actions  

My ballot

In the interests of full disclosure:

1. Matt Kemp 2. Ryan Braun 3. Roy Halladay 4. Joey Votto 5. Clayton Kershaw 6. Justin Upton 7. Jose Reyes 8. Troy Tulowitzki 9. Cliff Lee 10. Shane Victorino

http://www.thegoodphight.com

by WholeCamels on Nov 19, 2011 8:59 AM EST reply actions  

Rec’d for Lequan

#SWAGGG

by secondroundpick on Nov 19, 2011 11:08 AM EST up reply actions  

Why didn’t MikeyCo or stillnotah8er make the ballot?

BIAS’D!

Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.

by TheOrangeCone on Nov 19, 2011 4:56 PM EST up reply actions  

DMC? I’m going to kick myself, when I figure out who that is.

by Cormican on Nov 21, 2011 12:58 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m psyched. That third-place finish just kicked in some bonus incentives.

by Wet Luzinski on Nov 21, 2011 9:12 PM EST up reply actions  

Off Topic: But apparently, based on the new CBA there is a good possibility that Madson will lose his Type A status.

Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.

That is all.

by EREX21 on Nov 19, 2011 3:15 PM EST reply actions  

I would hope that would mean Papelbon would also lose his, considering madson ranked HIGHER according to Elias.

"Sometimes, the balls that fall in are jam shots"...Hunter Pence, on BABIP

by Joecatz on Nov 19, 2011 3:29 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m hoping for the same.

Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.

That is all.

by EREX21 on Nov 19, 2011 3:58 PM EST up reply actions  

And then there is this:

Courtesy of mlbtraderumors.com

Under the new CBA, teams that sign the remaining Type A relievers will not be forced to surrender draft picks, a source tells Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports (via Twitter). The teams that sign those relievers and certain other Type A free agents will not forfeit draft picks but the teams that lose those players will still receive compensatory picks (from Twitter).

This means teams can sign Ryan Madson, Francisco Rodriguez, Heath Bell, and other top relievers this offseason without penalty. For a full list of this offseason’s free agents, including their Type A/B designation, check out MLBTR’s free agent tracker.

The measure is not retroactive, meaning that the Phillies will still surrender their first-round pick for signing Jonathan Papelbon

.

Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.

That is all.

by EREX21 on Nov 19, 2011 4:07 PM EST up reply actions  

FU************

Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months.

-Oscar Wilde

by VanceinmyPants on Nov 19, 2011 4:18 PM EST up reply actions  

That doesn’t seem fair. I mean, really really not fair.

Changes like this should be post-dated to take place next year or whatever.

by Phrozen on Nov 19, 2011 4:29 PM EST up reply actions  

In what universe is this fair?

by esentman on Nov 19, 2011 4:33 PM EST up reply actions  

What manner of dipshittery be this?

Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.

by TheOrangeCone on Nov 19, 2011 4:52 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Yeah, just stopping by to see the take on this. Totally agree: super unfair.

by Trev223 on Nov 19, 2011 5:54 PM EST up reply actions  

although, frankly, it serves Amaro right for not fucking waiting

by yolacrary on Nov 19, 2011 7:56 PM EST up reply actions  

You ain’t kidding.

by Trev223 on Nov 19, 2011 11:18 PM EST up reply actions  

hahaa, so they lose their 1st rounder by signing Papelbon, and won’t get a first rounder back from whoever signs Madson? Smuggles’ impetuousness strikes again.

I find it hard to believe that this comes as a total shock—the teams and their reps must have been in contact about this stuff, right? Are these negotiations done under some veil of secrecy that forces GMs to fly blind? If there’s a real concern this might happen how do you not just wait a week or two? I’m assuming the “compensation” pick will just be the 1-2 sandwich pick? Just ridiculously inept management. Of course, that’s nothing new for Rube the rube.

RAJ needs to #OccupyTheUnemploymentLine

by 88Lindros88 on Nov 19, 2011 8:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Assuming that Rosenthal’s tweets are true, I find completely plausible the possibility that Ruben knew full well this would happen and just didn’t care. When he lost a first round pick to sign Ibanez and didn’t get one back for losing Burrell, he didn’t care.

by taco pal on Nov 20, 2011 1:01 AM EST up reply actions  

The fact that no one is making a big deal about it (considering Madson was ranked HIGHER than Papelbon) leads me to believe that teams were informed that if they signed a Type A prior to the CBA being redone that the rules would stay the same, and no guarantees were made…

Still sucks.

"Sometimes, the balls that fall in are jam shots"...Hunter Pence, on BABIP

by Joecatz on Nov 20, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions  

It seems to me that as time has passed, Ruben has become less and less concerned about the “costs” side of any decision matrix. He wants his guy, and he’ll pay whatever it takes to get him, when he wants to get him. He only sees what’s coming in and doesn’t care about what’s going out.

Losing the pick is awful but we already knew we were in the realm of awfulness for paying $62 million for a closer. Given that we know our GM is capable of the latter, what reason do we have to be surprised if he casually threw in the former as well, just like he casually threw in Domingo Santana as a PTBNL, the cherry on top of an already overly generous prospect package for Pence? I don’t know if it’s accurate to call this inept management per se. It isn’t incompetence – it’s competently executing a destructive philosophy.

by taco pal on Nov 20, 2011 1:07 PM EST up reply actions  

The counter to the “he doesn’t care what’s going out” argument is Domonic Brown, who he’s managed to hold onto through the Halladay and Pence deals. There’s got to be some reason that he wasn’t sent packing there. Of course, keeping him in the organization is one thing, actually using him optimally is another all together.

To the larger point, the inability to objectively see how such a destructive philosophy is going to become largely burdensome to the team in a few years and has the potential to become insurmountable regardless of how much cash he may be able to throw at the problem, I would argue, is incompetence. Essentially, creating that destructive philosophy is incompetence if you believe that the GM’s job is generally to care for the health of the organization. Rube’s scorched earth tactics do not accomplish that, obviously.

/semantics

by 88Lindros88 on Nov 20, 2011 3:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Speaking of things coming back to bite you in the ass.
we WILL offer [Madson] arb. And we WILL get a sandwich + a first or second. it’s a guarantee.

by Nikk.m on Nov 12, 2011 11:19 AM EST

Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.

by TheOrangeCone on Nov 20, 2011 3:04 AM EST up reply actions  

Yep, I was waiting for that.

Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.

That is all.

by EREX21 on Nov 20, 2011 8:57 AM EST up reply actions  

Well per Rosenthal we still get a sandwich pick yes?

Formerly... "You don't have to be sweet, to be good"

by Ed Van Chimp on Nov 20, 2011 12:24 PM EST up reply actions  

I believe so.

Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.

That is all.

by EREX21 on Nov 20, 2011 3:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Of course, this is from Ken Rosenthal via Tweets. It might be wrong.

If it’s true, though, I really wonder how in hell they can consider this fairly.

by Phrozen on Nov 19, 2011 9:50 PM EST up reply actions  

it strikes me as odd that a new CBA would impact processes already set in motion

by yolacrary on Nov 19, 2011 4:02 PM EST up reply actions  

New CBA also includes HGH testing starting this upcoming Spring Training.

Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months.

-Oscar Wilde

by VanceinmyPants on Nov 19, 2011 4:14 PM EST reply actions  

Better take the rest of the HGH now, I guess.

by Phrozen on Nov 19, 2011 4:29 PM EST up reply actions  

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