Reports: Phillies Closing In on Jimmy Rollins
by WholeCamels on Dec 7, 2011 1:15 PM EST
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PrintNothing confirmed at this time but it's looking an awful lot like the Phillies and Jimmy Rollins are close to negotiating a new contract for the veteran shortstop.
These things obviously have a way of falling apart sometimes so check back for more...
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Remember when the Phillies were closing in on Ryan Madson?
Good times.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
still in the act of closing in boss
I don't normally read stats, but when I do, the names Detweiller, Eric or Don are involved.
Stay educated, my friends
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Dec 7, 2011 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, a month ago the price for Madson was 4 years, $44 million. Now Ruben might get him for 1 year/$8 million. That’s some fine negotiating.
I’m not trying to stick up for RAJ in all cases, however in this case, it’s not like Boras did much better. Boras messed up if Madson has to settle for arbitration. I can hear the conversation now. Madson to Boras: “You have to answer for Santino, Scott”.
by dp on Dec 7, 2011 4:23 PM EST up reply actions
I love Jimmy but I’m not looking forward to having him lead off for the next 4 years, and I’m a bit disappointed that we seemingly aren’t upgrading our offense at all. I guess we’ll see if Rube has a trick or two left up his sleeve.
The bench looks pretty good.
Also, we had one of the best offenses in the NL last year. I don’t know how much more we can upgrade it.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
I was just about to say. Last year our bench blew, this year its actually pretty awesome.
"I'm terrible" - Ilya Bryzgalov
Gload wasn’t bad until he got hurt. Other than that, it was meh.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
The team won 102 games last year. Stop trying to blow up the roster. Lack of success in a crapshooty playoffs is no excuse to overhaul the best team in baseball. Seriously, stop.
by Liverp on Dec 7, 2011 1:37 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
Exactly right. This also relates back to my last article. If this team won 102 games but had better “balance” between its hitting and pitching, would people be clamoring to upgrade the team? If not, then neither should people be clamoring to upgrade a team that won 102 games with an imbalance between its hitting and pitching. 102 = 102.
The problem is 2008 was built on an exceedingly good offense and merely decent pitching outside of Cole’s playoff mastery. If the stats do not back up this conclusion, I apologize. I’m merely going off the old eye test, which most definitely confirms my suspicions. Either way, the point is too many people are focusing on hitting in the playoffs winning (Phils, Yanks, Cards) and seem to think that we need to scale back the pitching and up the offense. It’s not altogether an outrageous belief, but as your article pointed out, it’s just not based in anything concrete.
Your eye test is sort of right. The graph on the right below shows the offense (green line) relative to the league average. 2008 and 2010 were actually very similar, and in 2009 they had a better offense but worse pitching. 2011 overall had great pitching of course, and offense which was somewhat worse than 2008. And from May 23rd on (Utley’s return), the 2011 offense was actually better than in 2008.
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Celebrating over 50 years of slightly more Phils wins than losses: 1961-2011
by schmenkman on Dec 7, 2011 2:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
heh, I was just at beerleaguer, surprised to see you setting the record straight… (surprised to see myself there, too!)
wow that place has gone downhill
Did it used to be better? I haven’t been there much. There seem to be some reasonable folks, as well as some who seem to have wondered over from philly.com or csnphilly.
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Celebrating over 50 years of slightly more Phils wins than losses: 1961-2011
3-4 years ago it was a lot different, I think. I used to post there before I came here. Mostly rational folks.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
One other thing I also find amusing
about all the people who believe an excellent offense is the key to playoff success, is that it is pretty much a lens-based argument. By that I mean that all the people who believe that the Cardinal’s won based primarily on their great offense in the playoffs completely neglect that they only scored one run in the critical game five of that series. And it is certainly logical to believe that the Phillies offense stunk in that game (which it did), but it is also equally as logical to believe that the Cardinal’s pitching was particularly awesome in that game (which it was). In other words, it is just as valid to suppose that the Cardinals beat the Phillies because their pitching “stepped it up” as it is to believe that their offense “stepped it up,” since, really, both offenses were pretty ‘bad’ for most of that series.
Apparently we’re “out” on Gio. I wish this signified Amaro’s interest in keeping Brown, but we all know that is downright foolish thinking. I say this tongue-in-cheek to an extent, but it’s possible that we’ve run out of viable minor league talent to make anymore gaudy moves. That’s..good?
If the Phillies do not intend to use Brown this season, it would seem safe to say he is very much available. Sure this is speculation, but in the “win now” mindset, I fear Ruben will do anything this year at the expense of anything else down the road. Maybe all of the beat writers keep mentioning Brown in trades for the wrong reasons, but it isn’t at all encouraging that it keeps happening.
I think one good and bad thing about Ruben is that he isn’t consistent. Just because some decision X is demanded by taking his philosophy to its logical conclusion doesn’t mean that Ruben will want to do X.
indeed, it could be that it’s the A’s who brought him up
that’s the thing with these rumors: who the hell knows who mentions what part of rumored deals?
I suppose then that I want to hear Ruben actually endorse Brown. I don’t think it’s unreasonable for Ruben to find a microphone and say “Brown is our best prospect. He’s going to be in AAA to improve fielding. Under no circumstances is he available for any player. Thank you.” Instead, I see knee-jerk reactions to acquire a goofy right-fielder and pissed off fans screaming for his head. I just remain cautiously pessimistic about the entire regime.
Fair enough. Except for one point: I don’t think the trade for Pence was knee-jerk. I suspect they recognized that Brown’s defense a) needs a lot of work and b) will be easier to hide in left. Meaning they wanted a right-fielder, and identified Pence as their guy (who is not just goofy, but pretty damn good). Now whatever one thinks of the trade itself (or its necessity at the time), I think that’s what they were thinking viz. Brown.
I was sort of wondering about how things get out there. Like, somebody that works for the A’s mentions to a reporter that the Phillies inquired about Gio. So he tweets that, and so another reporter goes up to somebody from the Phillies and asks if Dom could be included in a deal for Gio. The Phillies’ guy gives the standard ‘we don’t discuss potential negotiations’ line. So the reporter tweets that his Phillies source does not deny that Dom Brown was discussed in trade talks with Oakland.
Or perhaps a reporter overheard the wrong parts of this conversation
Beane: My kid just got a Geo Metro.
Ruben: Yeah? They still make those? We used to have a Geo.
Beane: Car’s a piece of junk, I’m pretty sure the company folded. Hey, would you be interested in the Geo?
Ruben: What color is it?
Beane: Brown
Ruben: Brown? Geo? That’s rough, I’d have to think about that and get back to you, Buddy.
Beane (across the lobby): Okay, brown Geo, I’ll look forward to hearing from you. (laughs)
Rosenthal (to self): Gio – Brown? Wow, I need to get onto Twitter pronto.
by Cormican on Dec 7, 2011 2:51 PM EST up reply actions 8 recs
Ive gotten to the point where I no longer care IF we trade Dom, as long as we get maximum value. I’ve come to this conclusion not because I don’t think he can cut it. In fact I’m still 100% convinced that he’ll be a valuable all star caliber player for years to come.
But the thing is, if this team is going to stay in “built to win now” mode for the next few seasons, and Brown isn’t going to bs the starting LF or RF his season or next, because you can’t risk having a player develop at the ML level and win (which is not true, but obviously the org belief), then he has to be traded.
It just better be the right deal.
"Sometimes, the balls that fall in are jam shots"...Hunter Pence, on BABIP
I agree with you.
But I don’t think you can get max value for a guy you have been dangling for two years now and will probably continue to be dangled for the foreseeable future.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Brown isn’t going to bs the starting LF or RF his season or next…
This premise is questionable at best.
I’m as critical of the FO’s handling of Brown as anyone, but suspecting they may screw things up maximally isn’t the same thing as being sure they’re going to screw things up maximally. There isn’t anywhere near enough data to draw the latter conclusion.
haudricourt's tweet
#Brewers hearing that Jimmy Rollins is staying with Phillies, so looks like he’s out as possible SS option. Furcal, Gonzalez, Yuni left.
Those poor bastards. Maybe they’ll luck out and get Good Furcal.
Question: how irresponsible would it have been to trade the Pence package, or most of it thereof, for Gio?
This is a really rough way of doing it, but if Pence and Gonzalez repeat their 2010 for the rest of the time they would be under team control, Pence would be worth 9.4 fWAR for two years and Gonzalez worth 12.8 fWAR for four years. Depends on how much you value those extra years I guess. Also, even though Pence is under control for the next two years, he going to get expensive starting in 2012. Gio will still be cheap for a while.
Here are my reasons:
1 We already had Gio once and traded him away. I’d already be ambivalent about needing to trade prospects for him.
2 With the depth the team has in Starting Pitching, I’d rather acquire an outfielder.
Though, I hate both trades, I’d prefer the one we actually made.
Though, I hate both trades
Agree with this, so I don’t know why I’m bothering to continue, but it might be worth discussing weather we really have starting pitching “depth”. It seems unlikely that we get through the season with fewer starting pitchers than last year, and I think we had 7. Who is next in line after Kendrick now?
Again, not saying we should now or should have ever traded 4 prospects for Gio Gonzalez, but just curious: Starting pitching is a strength, but do we actually have starting pitching depth?
My guess at depth chart
1 Doc
2 Lee
3 Hamels
4 Cupcakes
5 Worley
6 KK
7 Hyatt
8 Cloyd (if he isn’t selected in the Rule V tomorrow)
Also, can’t rule out Moyer getting added to the bullpen and being option #6/7.
BTW, do you know where there is a decent scouting report on Hyatt? I heard pretty good things about him last year on discussion boards and whatnot, and I got to see him pitch in Reading. Of course he was dreadful that day and walked five or six guys in two innings or something.
I’m sure PF has written about him a few times if you search our archives.
He’s kind of a weird prospect since he was so old when he was drafted. I thought his performance last year was pretty encouraging though – AA wasn’t too age-inappropriate for him. Very good K/BB, but gives up too many homers.
My first reaction to this: “Hey, wait, maybe the SS market isn’t so bad…”
My second reaction: “Wait, Yuni doesn’t mean Yunel Escobar. Never mind.”
For comparison’s sake, Valdez played 210 games in that same time frame.
Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Valdez’s WAR would probably be better if there was a way to only calculate what he did as a shortstop. His UZR as a 3B last year was so bad that I’ll bet he had a negative WAR there.
That doesn’t sound like the dirty little secret that nobody wanted to talk about to me..
by Liverp on Dec 7, 2011 3:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
phillies-marlins 2012 lineups: 2011 WAR comparison
Assuming the Marlins sign Pujols, the Phillies sign Rollins
Ruiz (2.8) + Howard (1.6) + Utley (3.9 in 103 G) + Polanco (2.8) + Rollins (3.8) + Mayberry (2.5 in 104 G) + Victorino (5.9) + Pence (4.7)
Buck (1.8) + Pujols (5.1) + Infante (2.7) + Hanley (1.3 in 92 G) + Reyes (6.2) + Morrison (1.0) + Bonifacio? (3.3) + Stanton (4.5)
Totals
Phillies = 28.0 / Marlins = 25.9
This obviously isn’t supposed to be predictive, and the Marlins have more guys who are likely to improve on their 2011 performances than the Phillies do. Just thought it was interesting.
I do think the Braves are still going to be the biggest threat in the division, but not because of anything in this comment.
I need sleep
I keep seeing this headline on the frontpage and thinking it says “Phillies Cloning Jimmy Rollins”
And I think Morton is the only one of the three that they got for him that have had any type of ML career.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
What I’m saying is, it worked out well for the Pirates. They dumped an OK player who was about to start getting paid. They got back a decent pitcher who was and still is very cheap. The OK player fell off a cliff after the trade and they got him back for free. Maybe he’ll find the old magic again in 2012.
Some of that was unforeseeable, but it was the right decision. People accused them of being the “same old Pirates” but the move was actually smart and a change from the way they had previously run their team.
Oh I agree. I was just pointing out that unfortunately for them, none of the guys they got in the original trade have really amounted to much. But clearly, McClouth’s being there, or not being there had no impact on the Pirates performance, and it was never going to.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Not to nitpick, but actually, the other two players, Jeff Locke and Gorkys Hernandez, could still be decent ML pieces. Hernandez is only 23 and in AAA and Locke, at 24, threw almost 8 K/9 (albeit with almost 3 BB/9) in AAA this year. Totally reasonable to imagine those two putting it together, which just makes the decision that much better.
OT
MLB issues dress code guidelines for journos.
"He's a bum...this one stinks...this jerk can't play."-- A father teaching his daughter the Phillies lineup from the program roster, the Vet, c.1998
Press pass? Got it. Laptop? Yep. Muscle shirts, short skirts and flip-flops? Stop right there. … The no-wear list also includes visible undergarments, tank tops or anything with a team logo
Murphy, you ruined it for everyone.
The skimpy attire worn by some of the TV reporters covering the Marlins in Miami drew particular scrutiny. … Banned are sheer and see-through clothing, ripped jeans, one-shouldered, strapless shirts or clothing exposing bare midriffs. Also listed are “excessively short” skirts, dresses or shorts cut more than 3-4 inches above the knee.
Lucky the Marlins got coverage at all and now they want to complain about people showing some skin?
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Right?
"He's a bum...this one stinks...this jerk can't play."-- A father teaching his daughter the Phillies lineup from the program roster, the Vet, c.1998
“Oh, what I’d do to those girls if I only had two functioning hips…”
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
by doubleh on Dec 7, 2011 3:56 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Chooch diggin’ the Mermaid…this gig ain’t half bad!
"He's a bum...this one stinks...this jerk can't play."-- A father teaching his daughter the Phillies lineup from the program roster, the Vet, c.1998
Sorta short for JMjr
"He's a bum...this one stinks...this jerk can't play."-- A father teaching his daughter the Phillies lineup from the program roster, the Vet, c.1998
Got to be Perez. The socks are a giveaway.
That’s Carpenter behind Ruiz, right? But who’s behind Carpenter? Mathieson?
Cool
Good to hear Jimbo will (most likely) be back in red pinstripes. I thought at the beginning of the offseason that he was for sure heading to SF. Still hope it’s not an overpay.
Now Ruben’s next project: “What can I get for Freddy Galvis?”
The good news is he’s crazy young, so lots of time left to mature assuming a 3-4 year signing.
"I remember being three and I wanted to be a baseball player, that's all I ever really wanted to be. That and Spider Man." -Raul Ibanez
Ruben Amaro Jr. Delenda Est
by Jose and the Contrarians on Dec 8, 2011 12:43 AM EST up reply actions
This year is kind of make or break for Galvis. Either he builds on last year and becomes a legit Strating SS prospect. Or he regresses and the Phillies need to start playing him at 3rd, Second and possibly even some innings in the OF to see if he can be a super sub.
I don’t know about that. This will only be his Year 22 season. Lots of 22-year-old prospects aren’t even in AAA.
I’ve always been pretty bullish on Freddy, but if his bat regresses I’d have a hard time seeing him as a true prospect. Yes, he’s young for the level. Had he hit consistently at other levels it wouldn’t be an issue, but if he regresses, I’d be more inclined to think this year was a fluke.
I’m by no means saying give up entirely on him, just start preparing him for his most likely path to the Majors, which would likely be as a utility guy. If his bat comes back strong in 2013 and 2013, awesome make him a full time SS again. But if his bat regresses and stays there, at least positional flexibility can get him to the Bigs.
haha
I've been waiting my whole life for an Eagles Championship
R2C2!
RIP JJ
by sports00fan00 on Dec 7, 2011 3:39 PM EST up reply actions
By the way
What’s with all the Gio hate? I don’t want him either if we’re talking about moving Hamels but he’s a very good, young, cost-controlled pitcher who put up 9.2 WAR to Hamels’ 10.2 WAR over the last two seasons. Not in the same league but a damn good pitcher I’d be happy to have usually.
Maybe hate was a strong term
But David Murphy is right when he wrote today that “The Phillies front office wouldn’t be doing its job if it did not explore all of its options with regard to the Hamels situation.” If he felt like we had to trade Hamels (I hope not), getting Gonzalez is not the worst you could end up with.
I’m underwhelmed by Gonzalez but that could just be my personal distaste for pitchers who walk a lot of guys. second highest walk rate in baseball in both 2010 and 2011. he’s actually the only qualifying pitcher in baseball who walked more than 4 guys per 9 both seasons. granted he was still a quality SP both years (and the #3 pitcher in 2010 was CJ Wilson, who’s going to make eleventy million dollars this offseason), but those kind of guys drive me crazy.
Just for reference, that's B-R WAR
In Fangraphs’ WAR, it’s 6.7 for Gio to 8.6 for Cole.
Bob.
HanRam sweepstakes are officially on. Red Sox are also dangling Lowrie. Hopefully that gives RAJ some extra leverage.
Yep just saw it on Hot Stove.
Wilson expected to go to the Angels.
I guess Pujols back to the Cardinals.
So now it comes down to where does Fielder end up?
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Oh, God. That fucker’s still out there, isn’t he?
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
Their pitching overall is still pretty weak, and the Hanley situation will surely affect them, so I’d say 85-87 is a fair guesstimate.
Josh Johnson and Mark Buerhle are a nice 1-2.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
I like when the Phils face Volstad, personally.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
Hell, he probably could OPS at least 1.000 off him just from homers even with a torn Achilles.
by philsandthrills on Dec 7, 2011 5:36 PM EST up reply actions
Also, Phils won the WS in 2008 with Hamels, Moyer as their “aces,” and a rejuvenated second half Myers, Blanton and not much else.
I mean, it’s certainly plausible the goddamned Marlins could do it. And damn them if they do, but at least then they’d turn around and trade every one away next season.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
We could trade Dom, Galvis, and May to them for Reyes and Heath Bell!
Moyer for 5th Starter in 2012.
by Missing Jamie Moyer on Dec 7, 2011 5:25 PM EST up reply actions
If Johnson is healthy, and Hanley actually ends up playing 3rd base? 91.5
by philsandthrills on Dec 7, 2011 5:07 PM EST up reply actions
I’m seeing that I’m on the high end, but I guess it’s because I figure that Mike Stanton will be a major MVP candidate.
by philsandthrills on Dec 7, 2011 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
Over the last four years, their average record is 80.75 – 81.25. Assuming Hanley goes to third, and no more injuries than the last few years, I’ll say they’ll finish 86-78.
Marlins are going to give the Braves a run for their money. Nats might sneak up too if they pick up a CJ Wilson and a CF
They said on Hot Stove that Davey Johnson wants to move Werth to CF and have Harper play RF.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
this is like 20 minutes old, surprised no one on here posted it yet
http://twitter.com/#!/JimBowdenESPNxm/status/144537573790982144
JIm Duquette of SiriusXM is reporting that JImmy Rollins has agreed to terms with the Phillies
I've been waiting my whole life for an Eagles Championship
R2C2!
RIP JJ
Just denied on DNL per Jim Salisbury.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
that puts the nail in the coffin eh?
Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months.
-Oscar Wilde
by VanceinmyPants on Dec 7, 2011 6:24 PM EST up reply actions
NL East Rotations:
Phillies: Roy Halladay, Cliff Lee, Cole Hamels, Vance Worley, Joe Blanton
Braves: Tommy Hanson, Tim Hudson, Brandon Beachy, Julio Teheran, Mike Minor, (Jair Jurrjens?)
Marlins: Josh Johnson, Mark Buerhle, Ricky Nolasco, Anibal Sanchez, 5th starter (Volstad? C.J. Wilson?)
Nationals: Stephen Strasburg, Jordan Zimmerman, John Lannan, Chien-Ming Wang, 5th starter
Mets: LOL
by philsandthrills on Dec 7, 2011 5:23 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
The Mets don’t need any starters since they just signed every crappy reliever on the market last night.
Every time you feel angst or anger about this Phillies team, just close your eyes and imagine yourself as a Mets fan right now.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
Marlins officially out of Pujols Sweepstakes
jaysonst Jayson Stark
Sources say #Marlins have officially withdrawn offer to Pujols. Still in on CJ Wilson even after deal w Buehrle. More to come at ESPN.com
I've been waiting my whole life for an Eagles Championship
R2C2!
RIP JJ
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/12/07/ruben-amaro-the-phillies-want-to-keep-cole-hamels-for-a-long-long-time/
Hopefully this will calm down some people who are a little spooked.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but they could have avoided this by dropping Bowker off of the 40-man, right?
I’d almost rather remain ignorant of this rather than realize the stupidity behind this. I mean, it doesn’t matter how poorly you think of James development. Bowker is still John fucking Bowker.
by philsandthrills on Dec 7, 2011 9:46 PM EST up reply actions
Well you know we’ve been stockpiling so many prospects lately that we were bound to lose one in a Rule 5 pretty soon
koff
The really baffling thing was that, on PhuturePhillies, people were bummed that Gillies made it on the 40-man over James. I understand that they’re arguing from the condition that Bowker was going to be on the roster regardless, but the fact that that condition exists at all is crazy irritating.
That’s dumb. Gillies isn’t any worse of a prospect than James. And in any event, just because they’re both outfielders doesn’t mean you have to choose one or the other instead of someone else.
Wait, are we sure Bowker’s still on the 40-man?
I checked PP, but that roster didn’t have Laynce Nix
by philsandthrills on Dec 7, 2011 10:19 PM EST up reply actions
I wouldn’t have protected Erik Kratz either. I mean, I hope the guy gets a chance at some point to be a backup, but risking losing Jiwan James for the sake of a 31-year-old backup catcher makes no sense.
Not seeing Nix on that roster either.
by philsandthrills on Dec 7, 2011 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
Protecting Kratz and Bowker is insane. Even if they would be drafted, it’s fine. And no one will want them forced on their roster for a year. Especially not Bowker.
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
Would they even be subject to the draft? I would have thought that if they were left unprotected, they’d just have become free agents. Neither of them are in the first six years of their pro careers anymore, so wouldn’t they just be going year-to-year on minor league deals? Protecting them here didn’t mean protecting them from Rule 5, but protecting them from free agency by giving them major league contracts.
Which brings me to sunny point B. Neither of these guys is likely to make the team out of spring training. Which means that since they’re on major league contracts, they’ll need to be outrighted (I think that’s the term) to AAA. Which means they’ll have to pass through waivers anyway.
You don’t think Kratz will be on the 40-man all year? With Sardinha and Hoover gone, he’s the thid string now, right?
I don’t disagree that leaving Bowker on the 40 man is silly, or that we dodge a bullet when JJ didn’t get picked.
But I don’t see how the two go hand in hand, either… The organization has a limit to how many players in lower levels will take up 40 man spots, with no real shot of playing in the majors that year…. It’s likely that it came down to that.
they need a spot for Jimmy, and Nix, and there’ll be an invariable additional signing, etc…
"Sometimes, the balls that fall in are jam shots"...Hunter Pence, on BABIP
Agreed. The 40 already includes, by my count, 6 guys who stand almost no chance of playing in Philly this year:
Cesar Hernandez
Bello Garcia
Sebastian Valle
Carlos Rivero
Tyson Gillies
J.C. Ramirez
I can see that adding James could have been a logistical nightmare, since I don’t think Valdez has any more Options, Howard is going to eat a spot at some point, and there’s still offseason left for another signing or two to eat up spots.
Sure could have. Which, if they lose James, and I am sure they will, then it’s an inexcusable lose.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
I hope the Astros get him so that someday they can field a starting lineup that includes James, Singleton, Santana, Cosart, and Villar. It’s too bad they traded Gose.
According to the this Cubs site…
The latest buzz is that athletic prospect Jiwan James may go first overall.
I don’t where the buzz is coming from, but of course the Astros pick first.
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Celebrating over 50 years of slightly more Phils wins than losses: 1961-2011
Meh. It could have worked out well either way. He could have been a hell of a trade chip, or an expensive, but good, setup man.
that would have been one insane back end of the bullpen.
Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months.
-Oscar Wilde
by VanceinmyPants on Dec 7, 2011 10:42 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, but I’d rather just get the picks and not have to deal with any more salary confusion.
by philsandthrills on Dec 7, 2011 10:43 PM EST up reply actions
Did K-rod accept arbitration?
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
The Royals and Pirates just completed a deal where the three players involved were named Yamaico Navarro, Brooks Pounders, and Diego Goris. Greatest trade in MLB history.
Brooks Pounders
Screw it, trade everyone for this guy.
by philsandthrills on Dec 8, 2011 1:16 AM EST up reply actions
No one left to trade
"I remember being three and I wanted to be a baseball player, that's all I ever really wanted to be. That and Spider Man." -Raul Ibanez
Ruben Amaro Jr. Delenda Est
by Jose and the Contrarians on Dec 8, 2011 1:48 AM EST up reply actions
Also also Scott Boras says Prince Fielder is the next Jimmie Foxx. Makes me wonder if he has muscles in his hair.
Or the next Mo Vaughan. One or the other.
Sure, probably somewhere in between, but dollars-to-doughnuts it’s much closer to Vaughn than Foxx.
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Celebrating over 50 years of slightly more Phils wins than losses: 1961-2011
WAR graphs for illustration.
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Celebrating over 50 years of slightly more Phils wins than losses: 1961-2011
Also, according to (I know, I know) MLB Trade Rumors (link), there is a third, mystery team in on the bidding who has an established first baseman. So begins the wrongheaded speculation of Pujols2Phils!
God, that would be almost sortof just like Amaro. Howard for Gio Gonzalez, Hamels for Cody Ross and prospects, and signing Pujols for seventeen years and one billion dollars.
Howard for Gio Gonzalez
Straight up? I’d be thrilled. The problem is that Oakland will not (and no one else either) take on that salary.
The other deals? Not so much.
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
Wow, they want it bad, don’t they?
Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.
by TheOrangeCone on Dec 8, 2011 11:11 AM EST up reply actions
I’m not surprised at all. The $$$ and full no-trade? Maybe. But I used to live in the next town over from Anaheim Stadium. And with Arte Moreno owning the club, I was surprised that they had not been labeled as big players previously.
There is no other club that could cash in on Pujols like the Angels, and yes that includes the Marlins.
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
Good for them I suppose. He’ll be their DH for the 2nd half of that contract.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
No doubt. It would not surprise me if the $$$ are front-loaded (exactly the opposite of the Marlins).
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
Unless the accountants in Anaheim are predicting a second Great Depression that’d be insane. Ceteris paribus, I’d want all my long contracts backloaded if possible.
Not clear yet, but “believed” to be backloaded.
Details of Pujols’ deal aren’t official until the Players Association authorizes the contract, but it is believed to be backloaded with no money deferred and include a 10-year personal service arrangement that precludes Pujols from reconnecting with his former franchise.
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Celebrating over 50 years of slightly more Phils wins than losses: 1961-2011
Rule 5:
Lendy Castillo was taken 6th by the Cubs.
James has not been selected yet.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Weird that Castillo got taken. I guess it’s easy enough to shield a reliever on a 25-man roster, but a 22 year old who hasn’t moved past A ball seems like he’ll have a steep learning curve.
Still, shame to lose a guy who has a 9.0 K/9.
I was just about to post something similar Trev. Extremely curious, especially with the Cubs, unless Theo is planning to just junk this season. I could see the Pirates, Royals, etc. The Cubs? With those expectations?
And Herndon was in AA, wasn’t he? Castillo was at Lakewood, not Clearwater.
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
OK, that makes slightly more sense. Of course, OF is harder to hide (see above).
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
It would be hilarious if it was actually Theo’s braintrust that was confused.
“Uh, we pick….Leandro Castillo…no, wait, that’s not right….”
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
My favorite pick, per MLBTR:
Royals take Cesar Cabral from Red Sox; traded to Yankees for cash.
“Hey Royals, we want to mess with the Sox. Can we interest you in some $$$?”
GMAT verbal section question, Philadelphia sports version.
In 2015, which one of the following will prove to be a better investment?
(a) Ilya Bryzgalov's contract (b) Ryan Howard's extension (c) Mike Vick's extension (d) Greek bonds from 2009 (e) Papelbon's bloat deal
I consider a victory that the Phillies didn’t lose James and didn’t wasting a roster spot on a pick of their own.
from my marginally informed perspective it doesn’t seem like too much of a loss whether it’s Castillo or Castro, although it’s still aggravating that John F. Bowker got a 40-man spot over them.
by perfectdepth on Dec 8, 2011 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
I’m curious to know if the Phillies are going to get in on the bidding for Yu Darvish? I don’t know what kind of money the whole procedure is going to command but it seems likely to be cheaper than signing a top-line pitcher via free agency. Plus, it could do wonders for revenue with all the money coming in from marketing in Japan. I’d personally like to see them make a run at the guy.
That would effectively end Hamels’s career in Philly, since we already have a surplus of starting pitching and a draining supply of funds to sign players. I don’t know a whole lot about the NPB or how well pitching success there translates into pitching success here, but if he’s as good as everyone says he is, then it’s not going to be cheap. Remember that Boston posted a bid of over $51 million for Dice-K.
Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.
by TheOrangeCone on Dec 8, 2011 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
I guess it all depends on how the FO would handle the deal if they indeed were interested. Halladay has a year and an option left, right? I would assume it would basically be the cost of Oswalt (maybe smaller contract, but with the post put in) and the Phillies could probably move Blanton for a decent prospect to offset the payroll.
Dice-K was pretty good in Japan, but I don’t think it was anywhere near the success of Darvish and Darvish is also pretty young (23, 24?). If they could sign Hamels to an extension and take a chance on Darvish (at a reasonable price, and because of Dice-K’s failings in the US, I really don’t think Darvish will get what his hype would normally generate), I would be all for it. Like I said, we could end up with a really good pitcher and a ton more marketing revenue.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMkKk8s0CFI&feature=player_embedded#!
His offspeed stuff looks pretty wild.
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/darvish-is-not-daisuke/
Good article comparing the two.
It’s a stretch and it would also be a gamble. I’ve been pretty interested in Darvish for a couple of years now though. At worst, it would be Dice-K all over again and we’d lose Hamels. At best, we could add one of the best pitchers in the league for 5 years.
Blanton’s stock is currently very low, probably lower than it’s been during his career. He’s coming off of two seasons where he’s been either injured or ineffective. You may get a fringe-y prospect or two for him, but you’d also have to eat a little bit of his salary, which I believe is around $11 million for this season. A more realistic scenario for obtaining Darvish would be dealing away one of the three aces, which at this point is most likely to be Hamels since he’s approaching free agency and is due for a huge payday. It may pay off big, but I’m not so sure.
Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.
by TheOrangeCone on Dec 8, 2011 10:54 PM EST up reply actions
I agree with you about Blanton. I think the Phillies can afford all of this though without much of a hitch. Like I said before, you’d basically be replacing Oswalt’s salary while losing a little there (Madson, etc) and gaining a little there (Hamels, Pence, etc.).
If they could move Blanton (and even eat a little salary) and get SOMEBODY for him, they could remain under the luxury tax and have a Hamels extension kick in next year. There’s some handicaps here, but I think it could possibly work to the best possible outcome.
I don’t know, I just have a thing about Japanese players. When they’re good, they’re very exciting to watch.
Oh yeah, for sure. I have a particular fondness for sidearm pitchers and guys who throw splitters. They’ve got a bunch of those in Japan, and some of them are really good.
Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.
by TheOrangeCone on Dec 8, 2011 11:25 PM EST up reply actions
I agree about his stuff though. That hook of his is stupid good.
Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.
by TheOrangeCone on Dec 8, 2011 10:55 PM EST up reply actions
Rule V
I’m fairly surprised no one took Tommy Pham or Nick Barnese
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