Some Monday Phillies Links For You, March 14, 2011: Kids in the Hall
by FuquaManuel on Mar 14, 2011 5:58 PM EDT
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PrintThe Phillies snuck by the Astros 7-6 in today's Grapefruit action. On the pitching side, Cole Hamels got roughed up a bit (3.2 IP, 7 H, 5 ER, 1 BB, 4 K, 3 HR) and caused a shouting match when Bill Hall took exception to a pitch up and in. Mathieson, Bastardo, and Herndon all contributed scoreless frames. With the bats, John Mayberry (2/3, 2B, BB, SB) and Josh Barfield (1/2, 2 RBI, SB) continued to strengthen their candidacies for spots on the Phillies bench.
Phillies:
Astros’ Bill Hall calls Phillies’ Hamels ‘a marked man’ after altercation
Okay Bill, whatever.
Phillies beat Astros, though left-hander Cole Hamels struggles
"I don't know him personally, but I do know he is a good guy," Hamels said. "Just kind of something that just kind of happens." Kind of, ya know?
Another Phils injury: Lidge has biceps soreness
I might be wrong, but I don't see this as THAT big of a deal. Madson>Contreras>Lidge.
Projecting the Roster: Attempt # 2
Apropos of Taco Pal's post this morning.
Utley Update (Kind Of)
This is from Saturday, but it seems to have slipped under the radar.
Ruben Amaro Jr. a GM of many talents
Renaissance smug.
Fantasy Beat: Know Your Enemy
Bill "Crashburn Alley" Baer takes a look at our fantasy draft over at Baseball Prospectus. He was befuddled by Phrozen's selection of Jamie Moyer with the 301st pick. I think even Phrozen was befuddled by his selection of Jamie Moyer.
Elsewhere in baseball:
Operation shutdown? Not according to Johan Santana
I love Cliff Lee and Roy Halladay, but this is probably a cautionary tale against signing pitchers on the wrong side of 30 to long, expensive deals.
Nyjer Morgan thinks Ricky Nolasco purposely plunked him
Oh yes, this is still going on.
Aaron Rowand Walks Quietly
Soldier for wins.
And now, a new feature in our (almost) daily link dumps...
Stupid thing written about baseball of the day:
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The IIATMS guys got the most pissed off there.
Hirsch just sounded like a completely pseudo-intellectual with regard to sabermetrics, which is a step above Joe Morgan, but a lot more insidious in many ways.
by WanderingMoses on Mar 14, 2011 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions
I especially liked King Kaufman’s response:
It’s very impressive that the Hirsh brothers were able to parlay a series of factual errors (saying the A’s "crashed and burned" after "Moneyball" when in fact they won 90 games in each of the next four years after the season covered in the book, going to the playoffs twice and the American League Championship Series once; not understanding that a statistically inclined general manager being upset that a lucky shot beat his team does not equate to statistically inclined fans hating the idea of lucky shots, and so on, and, I’m guessing, and so on and so on) and a pile of strawman arguments (saber-"obsession" is somehow opposed to appreciating the game’s beauty and surprise; sabermetricians "deny or rebel against" baseball’s spontaneity, etc.) into a book contract.
Nice work if you can get it.
In their next book, the Hirsh brothers put the boot in on those round-earth fools, whose stubborn refusal to see the beauty and wonder in the flat landscape around them threatens to deny the rest of us the simple pleasure of a picnic at which our drinks don’t spill.
It really sounds like a take on sabermetrics from somebody who knows knows nothing about the subject. Of course sabermatricians know the role luck plays in the game, and they try their very best to account for that. Nobody is claiming that baseball is absolutely predictable.
Needless to say, I don’t think I’ll be reading the book.
I’ll never claim to be an expert on sabermetrics, but even I know that any social science mathematical system involves a “human element” which attests to the fact that their system is not foolproof and allows for “accidents” (like bloop singles, broken bat hits, dropped balls, homers carried by the wind, etc.). His article is like someone writing a book claiming that all the politicians who say that FDR was a popular president are wrong because people voted against him.
by Veni Vidi Vici on Mar 14, 2011 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions
The real reason is people felt bad for him cause of his wheelchair
by SportingFanaticism on Mar 14, 2011 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions
I agreed with this take
Westside guy // Mar 12, 2011 at 8:43 pm
I wonder if Hirsch actually believes this? This seems almost crafted to our political times – with the rise of the Tea Party folks and anti-intellectualism being celebrated, I tend to suspect the author more of an attempt to find a new, unfilled (and therefore profitable) niche in sports writing rather than actually holding these statements seriously.
He makes counter-arguments against points that don’t actually exist – almost as if he were to state "red is not the opposite of two, despite what others say". It’s as if he’s lamenting against the statistician that warns how five heads in a row doesn’t change the odds of the sixth toss – "those sterile lab-coated analysts who refuse to enjoy the mystery of the coin flip".
In terms of the anti-intellectualism. The Tea Party part isn’t fair, as anti-intellectualism existed before Obama became POTUS, but the basic premise that people may dislike it simply because they can’t/don’t want to understand it is fair.
I didn’t exactly read it that way. I don’t think Hirsch wants to be anti-intellectual. It’s just that he wants to posture himself as being pro-arts, pro-poetry, pro-beauty, etc., and therefore anti- the dehumanizing influence of seeing people as commodities instead of individuals, mechanization, etc.
Of course he’s being stupid, as there isn’t really any contradiction between those two things if you understand context. Hirsch just can’t recognize that because he has such tunnel vision about his own self-conception.
I read it as a deep desire to remain traditionalist and a fear that sabremetrics could somehow ruin enjoyment of the game. To me, that is equivalent to people who deny the science of Global Warming, because they don’t want to be inconvenienced by having to embrace new technologies.
Sorry for delving slightly Political there.
Baer says sabermatricians underrate J.A. Happ. I guess I’m not a sabermatrician then, since I drafted him.
I really like him, and as happy as I am to have Oswalt in Philly, I’m still a little sad that it came at the cost of sending Happ to Houston.
by dannijd on Mar 14, 2011 7:02 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I think he’s wrong. Mathieson joined the 40-man roster before the 2006 season. I assume he’s been on it every year since, although maybe that’s wrong. Most players have three option years, but a few exceptional cases have four option years. Mathieson pitched in the minors in 2006, 2007, 2009, and 2010. (He was hurt all of 2008 and presumably stayed on the major league roster via the 60-day DL the entire season.) Anyway, that’s four option years, no? Doesn’t that mean his options are exhausted? Maybe I’m missing something.
I agree. I’m not encyclopedic about the MLB transaction rules, but he has had four options because the last came in his fourth year as a professional. There’s no provision—anywhere—for a fifth option. Is there?
Can he give consent to being sent down again without needing to clear waivers?
I don’t think so but I’m not sure. Why aren’t the MLB Rules online? It’s not like there’s anything top-secret in them, is there?
The fourth option year gets triggered if your first three options were used before you played five “full seasons” in the pros. If you get hurt and are on the active roster for fewer than X games in a given season, then it doesn’t count as a “full season” for fourth-option purposes. In two of Mathieson’s seasons (‘07 and ’09), I think he pitched for fewer than X games, in the minors only. So those seasons don’t count as “full seasons” for fourth-option purposes. But they’re still option years, right?
cot's has a link
to the CBA for 2007-2011: http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/2003/01/transactions-glossary.html
by perfectdepth on Mar 15, 2011 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions
A full season is defined as being on an active pro roster for at least 90 days in a season. (If a player is put on the disabled list after earning 60 or more days of service in a single season, his time on the DL is counted.) The 90-day requirement means short-season leagues (New-York Penn, Northwest, Pioneer, Appalachian, Gulf Coast, Arizona Rookie, Dominican and Venezuelan Summer Leagues) do not count as full seasons for the purposes of determining eligibility for a fourth option.
maybe that’s what’s saving an option? I freely admit that I’m not up to speed on all this.
by perfectdepth on Mar 15, 2011 9:25 AM EDT up reply actions
That’s what I was talking about above. Clearly, Mathieson’s 2007 doesn’t count as a “full season” for the purpose of calculating whether he used three options in fewer than five full seasons (which would give him a fourth option). His 2009 probably doesn’t count as a “full season” either. But nothing in your quote says that his 2007 and 2009 don’t count as option years.
But this one goes to eleven.
Why look'st thou so?' -"With my crossbow
I shot the Albatross."
by RememberthePhitans on Mar 14, 2011 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions
The number of Mathieson’s options. They go to eleven.
Why look'st thou so?' -"With my crossbow
I shot the Albatross."
by RememberthePhitans on Mar 15, 2011 7:24 AM EDT up reply actions
I posted this on another thread just a minute ago. Sorry...
Asked Gelb on Twitter. He says: “Very convoluted and has never been explained well to me. But I believe it has to do with his release and re-signing in ’08.”
Training for the Phillies 5K Run on March 26th. Hoping I don't embarrass myself :-)
by LeepinLizardz on Mar 15, 2011 5:26 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He then added:
“He also became eligible for the fourth option status and 07 and 08 didn’t count because of injuries. I think.”
Training for the Phillies 5K Run on March 26th. Hoping I don't embarrass myself :-)
by LeepinLizardz on Mar 15, 2011 5:45 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He’s definitely a marked man for me now, so when I do some damage off him, I’m going to let him know I did some damage off him. I can guarantee that. … If you disrespect me, I’m going to do my best to disrespect you back. Obviously not in a way to disrespect the game, but obviously I’m going to let him know when I face him.
I love this quote hahaha… Big bad Billy Hall trying to let Hamels know who’s boss. I’m sure Hamels is really scared of Bill Hall and his .250 career average.
I don’t get how throwing a ball up and in is “disrespect.”
"Bickell to Brouwer to Bolland...BANG!" ~ Pat Foley, 12-26-10
Halladay, Oswalt, Hamels, Blanton, AND LEE!! HELL YES!
The commentators made it sound like it was a “purpose pitch” meant to let Hall know that Cole was not happy that he stepped out after the umpire denied his request for time. That being said, I do not see disrespect here, either- it is not like Cole pitched behind him/ at or near his head/ hit him.
by dannijd on Mar 14, 2011 11:40 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
FM, I enjoy how we agree on something for once
Madson > Contreras > Lidge
inter arma enim silent leges
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Mar 14, 2011 7:48 PM EDT reply actions
Ugh. Just had disagreement with hubby over dinner whether or not Madson has the ability to close. He says, “He’s tried it several times and has proven incapable of it.”
It’s come to the point where I can no longer discuss sports with him, which is just sad, since he’s the one who got me back into them in the first place.
Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.
If he ain’t straight yet, they’ve got bigger issues
by SportingFanaticism on Mar 14, 2011 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions
If that’s your biggest discrepancy, that aint too bad
inter arma enim silent leges
by CoburnsCuddleBuddy on Mar 14, 2011 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Nyjer Morgan would have been a great antagonist in the NBA back in the 70’s. And then he would have had his face broken.
GCobb.com thinks “It’s Time for the Phillies to Make a Move for Michael Young.” Also, perhaps this is a typo but the writer says “Blanton, who is owed $17 million of the next two years, and cash for Young, whose contract is good for three more years at $48 million, is a very plausible deal for Amaro and Rangers general manger Jon Daniels to make.” Yeesh.
Good lord, the both the rumor of this move and the support for it will not die. Why won’t it die?
by FearTheTurtIe on Mar 14, 2011 9:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Because Smuggles just said in a public venue that the Phillies are “maxed out” and “can not afford to make a move”… Which means we should all take nice long looks at Cupcakes, Polly, and whatever prospect we love most, because all are on the endangered species list.
by dannijd on Mar 14, 2011 11:43 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Ech, this article is awful. Some things that stand out to me:
Wilson Valdez is a good defensive fill-in for Utley at second base, but he’s not the greatest of hitters.And Pol Pot wasn’t the nicest guy in the world. Also, this:
Pat Gillick, who preceded Amaro, was successful in his short stint as the Phillies general manager because he was a master at "The B-List" of players and that was a key part to the club winning the World Series in 2008. But, the Phils won that year because they got hot at the right time, not because they were a league-wide powerhouse.Uhh, what? That’s the first I’ve heard of anyone making excuses for a World Series win. Also, he seems to equate “aggressive” with “smart and sensible,” and fails to recognize that no matter how “aggressive” the move, it doesn’t prevent it from being a bad and/or idiotic one.
Since Gillick left after 2008 and Amaro took over, the Phillies remained good and became great. They did so because of Amaro’s aggressiveness to make big time deals rather than revert to "The B-List."
by FearTheTurtIe on Mar 14, 2011 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Valdez could be worse as a hitter.
As for utilization of the “B” list to build a champion, I thought that was what all teams not the Yankees did- build a great nucleus then bring in some pieces, including some fringy ones and hope to get lucky once in a while (or, in the case of the 2010 San Francisco Giants, a lot)
by dannijd on Mar 14, 2011 11:45 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
randy miller
Good news: Says Michael Young is a bad fit for the Phillies
Bad news: Says Phillies should pick up David Eckstein
This Utley situation has really cast into stark relief just how weak a grasp on baseball many of the people who are paid to comment on the Phillies actually have.
Pessimism of the intellect, optimism of the will.
This.
OT: There were some escaped convicts in my area who were just caught. The reporter interviewing the lieutenant in charge just commented to him: “I hear you had a lot of manpowers involved in the search.”
Set your JVR in 2011.
The Internet is killing the English language anyway – not intentionally, it’s just happening and someone one should of scene it coming
by SportingFanaticism on Mar 14, 2011 9:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Don’t know if serious.jpg
"I remember being three and I wanted to be a baseball player, that's all I ever really wanted to be. That and Spider Man." -Raul Ibanez
by Jose and the Contrarians on Mar 14, 2011 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Writing their names in the snow.
Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.
Wait, morons really do that? I thought it was just in crappy movies.
by SportingFanaticism on Mar 14, 2011 10:13 PM EDT up reply actions
As for the options, I’m fine with Valdez filling in, but I think they should look into signing free agent middle infielder David Eckstein, a 36-year-old former World Series MVP who probably would take around $1 million, which is what he made last season hitting .267 for San Diego. This little guy is a good fielder and a pest at the plate who would be another Polanco in the lineup, a guy who does all the little things that lead to wins. As for Michael Young, despite all kinds of stories that he’s an option and potentially affordable, I think there’s no way the Phillies take on his contract – $16 million for this year, next year and the year after. There’s been speculation the Phils can trade fifth-starter Joe Blanton, who is owed $8.5 million this year and next, plus a good prospect to Texas for Young. Again, I don’t think there’s any shot this deal happens. No, I didn’t see Cliff Lee signing with the Phillies or Roy Oswalt coming in a trade last summer. But from everything I hear, the Phillies are over budget and absolutely will not take on more salary. . . . He’d be a very expensive bench player if Utley gets healthy. And what do you do with him next season? Do you move him back to shortstop for the first time since 2007 if Jimmy Rollins isn’t re-signed? Do you put him in the outfield as a possible replacement for Ibanez? He’s never played there. Bottom line: Michael Young isn’t a good fit.
who would be another Polanco in the lineup
TP, you and I don’t agree on everything, but I think we agree here that this statement is beyond idiotic.
Set your JVR in 2011.
I’d wager it’s more akin to a cry for help. A cry for help that involves a burning at the stake, but a cry for help nonetheless.
"I remember being three and I wanted to be a baseball player, that's all I ever really wanted to be. That and Spider Man." -Raul Ibanez
by Jose and the Contrarians on Mar 14, 2011 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t get how that would be a good thing….I thought one of those per lineup was more than sufficient.
by dannijd on Mar 15, 2011 12:08 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
In other news about our pal Rowand...
McCovey Chronicles wonders whether the Giants are better off just releasing him, since he’s a sunk cost.
This is the second “sunk cost” reference in TGP in 2 days!
Can “prospect theory” or “time compression diseconomies” be far behind?
Set your JVR in 2011.
I’m going to start using timey wimey wibbly wobley more often
by SportingFanaticism on Mar 15, 2011 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Utley in new ESPN commercial about opening day
Near the start of the commercial, there’s a “Good luck Chase” sign hanging from a building, and a view of Utley driving by, seeing it, and smiling.
Good luck indeed.
chondromalacia epidemic
Andre Iguodala was also just diagnosed with it. Sounds less severe than Utley’s though, as he’s only day to day.
david hale
Whoever it was who said last week that David Hale of the Delaware News Journal was the best Phillies beat writer was really on target. He does good work. Tidbits from his most recent post:
Rich Dubee an the pitchers were sitting around a table watching TV this morning when Roy Halladay’s Chooch pillow commercial came on. Dubee offered a few critiques. Always coaching.
Charlie stopped in the locker room for about 10 minutes to talk about mid-western beers. Apparently during his early days in baseball, he had a night job buying Hamm’s beer for bar patrons around the midwest. "That was a good job," he said. "Real good."
I am not entirely ruling out the notion that Lidge is just being given a couple days off to run the clubhouse NCAA tournament pool.
Buying beer for other people is a job?
by SportingFanaticism on Mar 15, 2011 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions
Used to be- breweries would send their sales people out with cash to buy their brand of beer for bar patrons- it was good advertising because it got people to try their beer. This has fallen out of favor in recent years, and may even be illegal.
by dannijd on Mar 15, 2011 11:11 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I wasn’t alive in the 50s and 60s but that sounds a lot like some sort of payola?
by SportingFanaticism on Mar 15, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
And exclusive contracts for beer with a sports league aren’t payola?
Why look'st thou so?' -"With my crossbow
I shot the Albatross."
by RememberthePhitans on Mar 15, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t believe Sponsorship is the same as artificially inflating a beers sales on a tavern by tavern basis (ala getting extra air play for a record?)
by SportingFanaticism on Mar 15, 2011 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
O/T
My son starts T-ball in a week. He is going to rock the Threshers logo. I am as excited for his season as I am for the Phillies. Says he wants to wear #6 just like Ryan Howard. /proud mama’d
Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.
He’s too young to understand contracts, clearly. One day it will all make sense to him.
Pessimism of the intellect, optimism of the will.
by FuquaManuel on Mar 15, 2011 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Ha ha. I just hope he makes contact.
Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.
Marcus Hayes
Just said on DNL that Madson doesn’t have swing and miss “stuff”. His “stuff” isn’t good enough to close.
OMFG.
Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.
OMFG is right
I might be misremembering (to quote the great man), but isn’t Madson’s change-up one of the most swung-on-and-missed pitches in baseball?
http://www.thegoodphight.com
Madson had the third-lowest contact percentage in all of baseball last year. only behind Carlos Marmol & Jonny Venters.
by perfectdepth on Mar 15, 2011 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, check it out:
http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2011/3/9/2039802/best-whiff-rates-of-2010
Yet another reason to not watch DNL!
by dannijd on Mar 15, 2011 8:46 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Can’t help myself—I watch it everyday. It’s how my day ends. Some days the guests are better than others. You know it’s a bad day when Sam Donnellon is the voice of fucking reason.
Aristotle was not Belgian, the principle of Buddhism is not "every man for himself", and the London Underground is not a political movement.
I have only seen it a couple of times, and the thing that I was overwhelmed by was both their reactionism and their negativity- a lot of times it seemed like they did not have a good word to say at all about the Phillies, regardless of the results of the day’s outing- I have found that they, and WIP have to stay off in my universe. They make me feel negative.
I was going to snark, but I came up empty, both with a comment and emotionally.
Marcus Hayes left it behind: the moon at my window.
Why look'st thou so?' -"With my crossbow
I shot the Albatross."
by RememberthePhitans on Mar 15, 2011 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Great haiku- really enlightening and totally wonderful!
by dannijd on Mar 15, 2011 9:30 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
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