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Domonic Brown and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Day in Allentown

Front-Paged. Although I hope this is just a reaction to one bad game, it's really unfortunate that the recent success of the Phillies has made a large portion of the fanbase so impatient. - WC

Tonight, on August 29th, 2011, I witnessed what we should all hope will become the nadir of  a long and wonderful baseball-playing career of Domonic Brown.  We should hope this because there is so much clearly-demonstrated promise in this young outfielder.  And we should hope for better, for him, because any point reaching lower than tonight's nightmare borders on the tragic.

More thoughts after the jump...

Star-divide

The double-header, scheduled thanks to tempestuous Hurricane Irene, between the Lehigh Valley IronPigs and the Syracuse Chiefs started off badly for Domonic Brown, and only got painfully worse.

Facing Chiefs left-hander, and Washington Nationals' 2010 Minor League Pitcher of the Year, Tom Milone, Brown struck out in his first at bat of the night to end the bottom of the first inning.  This moment, along with Brown's two ground-outs to second (one against Milone in the 4th, the next against south-paw reliever Atahualpa Severino in the 6th) might actually have been the high points of Brown's evening.

To be fair, none of the Iron Pigs did much against Chiefs pitching in either of the 7-inning games (the lone exception might be Freddy Galvis, who looked, tonight at least, like Lehigh Valley's best player).  The Iron Pigs were shut-out in both games with identical scores of 4-0, mustering a total of eight hits in the 14 combined innings.  

However, Brown's nightmare was not confined to the batter's box, though I'm sure he wishes that it could have been.

In the top of the first inning, the Chiefs began their scoring on the first of Brown's miscues in Left Field.  A line-drive off the bat of Jesus Valdez headed straight for Brown, freezing him, with the ball then continuing over his head.  Ruled a double, it was a tough play, perhaps the toughest of Brown's numerous misplays on the night, but it was a play he probably should have made.

In the top of the 4th inning, Chiefs' First-Baseman Jeff Frazier hit another line drive to Brown, this time in front of the Iron Pigs' Left Fielder.  Brown came sprinting in for the ball, whereupon it clanked off his glove, chest high.  Originally ruled E-7, the Official Scorer later took mercy on Brown, granting Frazier a very generous single.  This would be the last bit of mercy offered to Domonic Brown.

Brown and the Iron Pigs looked to rebound in Game Two, just 30 minutes after a listless 4-0 loss in Game One.  The very first batter of the double-header's second game, the part-time Washington National, Roger Bernadina, lifted a lazy fly ball to left field.  But this wasn't just any fly ball.  As it headed toward Domonic Brown standing underneath it, Brown's right arm stretched to the sky, the fly ball became a cruel joke, became a disease, became an assassin, became a snow-cone at the end of Brown's glove, became an egg, broken in the soft grass of Coca-Cola Stadium.

The people of Allentown, most of them Phillies fans, were too shocked to boo.  They just witnessed the third of Brown's misplays, and the most egregious one, out of four total chances (Brown did catch Steve Lombardozzi's fly ball in the top of game one's 7th inning).   The colliding surrealities of the double-header, the extra beers, the psychedelic pink sunset peeking beyond the scattered clouds, made us all think we were all there together, caught inexplicably in Dom Brown's inescapable nightmare.

Wherever we were, and however we got there, the night continued.

After striking out weakly in the bottom of the first inning, it was then that the boo birds made their way through the tightened throats of Lehigh Valley to descend upon the tall, lanky, clearly affected outfielder, wearing, ironically perhaps, jersey number 7.

Two innings later, Dom Brown then struck out again, chasing a low breaking-ball, against Chief's starting pitcher, right-hander Brad Peacock.  The boos, a little louder this time, chased Brown back to the dugout, looking like a beaten dog.

An inning and a half later, the top of the 5th, Steve Lombardozzi, perhaps looking for revenge for the one ball Brown caught, sent another one Domonic's way, this time with horrifying results.  A lazy fly, Brown settled underneath it, reached his right arm up, and missed it.  The ball, laughing all the way down, landed several feet behind Brown, just as the Chief's second baseman took second base on a gift double.

Fighting through disbelief, the boos rained down harder.

My girlfriend and I stood along the right-field fence, just in front of Coca-Cola Field's "Bud Light Trough", with our hands first covering our eyes, shortly thereafter holding our heads.  We were sincerely saddened by this string of moments, fruitlessly trying to count the number of Domonic Brown mistakes, perhaps hoping we could enumerate them so we could offer equal number forgivenesses.

Making things worse were the boos, which were only getting more violent.  Worse still, the boos all came from white faces, momentarily flushed red from drink and from anger, all aimed at the only black player on the diamond for the Iron Pigs.

I questioned whether the fans wanted Brown to fail, right there in front of their eyes, thereby offering them the gift to lash out at him.  To enact their own venomous, slightly veiled, violence.

Myself born in 1976, I imagined, for a moment, 1964 and Dick Allen and Connie Mack Stadium.  Could so much history still live in bones and blood of these baseball fans?  Are racial tensions reborn deep inside the muddy waters of the Schuylkill River?  Are these 8,100 white fans so scared of or disconnected from (or both) Domonic Brown that they can't see the beaten soul out there they are so carelessly trampling upon?

Or maybe none of the racial complications are relevant, and the real truth is that Domonic Brown is a ball-player, and he is being confronted by the mythologically harsh judgement of Philadelphia-area baseball fans.

The optimistic view might be that the Universe (or perhaps BaseBa'al itself) is offering Domonic Brown a profound rite-of-passage-- an impossible, transformational opportunity to transcend from prospect to professional, from athlete to man.

In any case, the evening’s indignities were not done with him.  Double-switched out of the game after his fourth and final strike-out of the night, Brown endured the roar of the remaining IronPig fans, rejoicing in the announcement that Tagg Bozied was in the game, replacing Brown in left field, and offering a corporeal end to the nightmare (the memory, of course, is able to live on).

As the second game neared its final outs, I spoke with a ballpark usher about the night.  I was relieved to hear that this was the first time this usher heard these kinds of boos directed at Brown.  He told me he thought the fans were just reacting to a bad night.  This bit of news, delivered almost a bit flippantly by the usher, temporarily (and thankfully) suspends my doomsday narrative of The End of Domonic Brown.  Perhaps this night, like so many in the incomparably complex and beautiful sport of baseball, was just a bad night—a really terrible, horrible, no good, very bad night.

Perhaps all that’s needed is for Domonic Brown to shake it off, rub some dirt on this night, and play a better game tomorrow.  And the next day, and the next day.  And perhaps if he does, August 29th, 2011, will indeed be the welcoming but painful springboard of rock-bottom.

But perhaps it's true that things aren't as simple as that.  Because baseball, acting so often as a mirror that reflects everything around it, is a more complicated animal than simply having good days and bad days, and it's because of these reflective complications that I am so desperately in love with it.

It is my own hope that Domonic Brown can recover from this night, shake the nightmare from his body, and play a game tomorrow more worthy of his talent, more worthy of himself.  And if he does, and then plays himself back to Philadelphia after enduring this night (and all that it does or doesn't, may or may not signify), Domonic Brown, fans screaming at him forever, will always be one of my heroes.

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nice writeup

of an awful night.

booing your own players never makes sense to me, much less in the minor leagues.

by perfectdepth on Aug 30, 2011 7:40 AM EDT reply actions  

this also makes me think when Philly turns on Howard (and I’m pretty sure it’s “when,” not “if”) it will be very ugly.

by perfectdepth on Aug 30, 2011 8:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

Howard is definitely going to hear the backlash at some point, I’m afraid, but perhaps it won’t be as bad as all this- Howard has the benefit of his past and of being an integral part of the great teams in Philly over the past few years- perhaps that will at least shield him from spme of it.

"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."

by dannijd on Aug 30, 2011 2:36 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Brown does not deserve to be booed

But I’m pretty sure the fans booed because they were frustrated by Brown having a bad night and generally failing to live up to the hype this season. Pat Burrell was about the whitest person in North America, and Phillies fans booed him mercilessly his last couple years here. There’s really no reason to throw race into the story.

by mattjg on Aug 30, 2011 9:08 AM EDT reply actions  

P the B was treated very well his last year or two here. The middle years were the Bad Time.

And pointing out that one white guy was regularly booed in Philadelphia does not mean there is no racial motivation behind booing a black player.

by The Howling Fantods on Aug 30, 2011 9:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

But other than Dick Allen over 30 years ago, what evidence is there that there WAS a racial motivation behind the booing? Is there just an assumption that white players are booed for their performance but every time fans boo a black player there’s a racial motivation behind it?

by mattjg on Aug 30, 2011 9:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

Mike Schmidt was booed. Andy Ashby was booed. Adam Eaton was booed at the ring ceremony fer Chissakes.

"Miami can’t beat Chicago, why? Because Chicago has everything Miami has and more.... I’ll grant you Wade/James stealing a game, or maybe two. But we’re seeing an OKC/CHI finals, and that’s a finals everyone will tune in for." - LeQuan Glover

by yosoysean on Aug 30, 2011 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

Mike Schmidt’s rookie season numbers are strikingly similar to Dom’s. While this may lead him to building the foundation of a successful career, I think it’s probably also building the foundation for years of reluctant and begrudging support from the fan base with a spring loaded trip wire ready to unload on him for any minor infraction.

It’s a shame traditionalists can’t enjoy the game for what it is, and instead get hung up on esoteric ideals of how to play.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

This question of “how to play” intersects in weird ways with class and race issues. Mike Schmidt was perceived (I am told) as being “too cool” (wasn’t he called Captain Cool?). He always knew how much to give for a certain play, which meant he didn’t pointlessly go all out all the time. He was criticized for it by some, but the criticisms leveled at Rollins for similar behaviors have slightly different ring to them.

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, that last sentence was more of a shot at knuckle draggers who complain SABR-nerds can’t appreciate the game for what it is, because of all their fancy numbers and wizardry.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 11:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

One of these things is not like the other...

Eaton EARNED those boos!

"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."

by dannijd on Aug 30, 2011 2:50 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Fair enough, but the fact that a player is black and booed does not mean there IS a racial motivation either. Obviously race is still an issue in our society, but I like there to be some evidence rather than the fact that a person is black to support the allegation. While philly fans hated Donovan McNabb (I never did by the way and still love Donnie) they loved B Dawk. While they may dislike Brown (again I don’t get this), so many of the same members of our fan base are clamoring for Yayberry. It seems like fans are totally willing to embrace black players.

I suppose your argument could turn on the issue of the fact that our racial component only comes into play when someone fails… but we booed Raul when he struggled, which I guess you could argue is because his ethnic sounding name. But for white booed players, look no further than Cole Hamels, who especially in 2009, but even during the first mets game this season was terribly booed by fans. Also Cole, I might argue, is even whiter than Pat the Bat. However, he might be not the right kind of white—i.e. blue collar worker.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 9:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

I work in a department of social psychologists and have personally done empirical research on people’s racial attitudes… also never used the term race card. I find it sickening when people hide behind the issue of race just because the person in question is off a different race… this can actually worsen racial tensions.

I don’t doubt that many members of the fanbase are racists, I am questioning whether or not the example above is really explained by race.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 10:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry if it seemed like I was calling you out on that race card aspect specifically — the guy (then) directly below my post was using it, and I figured it would make a more readable reply to condense my thoughts. I think the question ought to be asked, too — I just replied to your post because it was the furthest down. It also was totally the most reasonable, so apologies for the misconception.

by Trev223 on Aug 30, 2011 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

It’s all good. But the question on this race issue is what evidence could convince you that it is not race? If the answer is none… then you are no longer making a falsifiable or empirical claim.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

it’s not a falsifiable claim, but it doesn’t need to be; it’s not lab science (nothing about sociology is)

really, the author seemed bothered by the spectacle of a bunch of white fans booing Domonic Brown.. “evidence”, in the way you mean it, is unnecessary, and by the way, impossible

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly my point — thanks.

by Trev223 on Aug 30, 2011 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

since you do research into such matters, I’d assume that you know that the question isn’t really whether a given example is “explained” by race, and that it’s more or less irrelevant whether people are personally “racist” (I prefer “bigoted”; “racism” is better understood as a stuctural term); it’s such a complicated intersection of factors…. however, any time an African American is accused of laziness, the history of racism and racial stereotyping inevitably looms large

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Evidence is always necessary when making claims. I think it’s silly to point out that racial tensions could be responsible for something because they exist—obviously they COULD be. Above I was saying that I like there to be some evidence for a racial component before bring that issue up as I mentioned above because this can often worsen racial tensions by brining this issue to the foreground.

We are again not talking about the “lazy” issue… we are talking about a ballplayer who was having one of the worst nights of his life and was booed by a fanbase known for booing people… I just don’t think you need the color of one’s skin to explain why fans would boo such a performance.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

What sort of evidence would work for you here? Would it have helped if the author interviewed a sample of the fans who booed and reported on his findings? Possibly in a peer-reviewed journal?

Look, booing has always struck me as childish. But I really cannot imagine going to a minor league baseball game and booing any of the participants, least of all a valued prospect clearly having a very rough evening. Maybe all the fans who booed, and booed more vehemently the worse it got, were fucking assholes. Is that better? I think the Romero was perfectly justified in speculating on a possible racial component.

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

which he also, incidentally, admits he is unsure about…. such is the nature of racism and how it affects us anyway: we are unsure how we are affected by it, unless it announces itself with forceful obviousness

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

and I guess I’m also justified for disagreeing with him? Yeah… thought so. One pice of evidence would be any overt bigotry… but that is kind of a high bar.

The kind of evidence I would like for such a claim is one comparative… is it the case that compared to white players with such a performance the boos are less. The claim I was making above is that this is really not so. In fact, in this particular instance, the performance is so bad that I think any fans would boo making the racial component just irrelevant. I agree that booing is kind of silly and I don’t boo my own players.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

oh, sure, you’re perfectly justified in disagreeing with him… how very postmodern of you.

Romero made a speculation, then admitted he was unsure about it. You’re the one coming in asking for evidence for a claim. And the other commenters, who are all “oh, this was great till you weirdly brought race into it, wtf” are pretending he did anything other than speculate, and implicitly make that comparison you’re demanding, before backing off a little.

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

Asking for evidence is postmodern… WOW! Quite the opposite.

I think all the WTF people are like me and they just didn’t see how that was relevant. If Dominic Brown fell off a building he would also die… The force of booing such a poor performance isn’t quite as predicted as falling due to gravity… but it’s pretty close. Both events (Dom being booed and dying from a fall) would happen in the context of racial prejudice…. just not sure how relevant either is.

I think racial hatred might even explain why people don’t like Dominic brown (I don’t really think this, but find this view defensible), but it doesn’t need to be invoked to explain the booing here.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

convincing rebuttal.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

your comment was terrible… the fact that you used the phrase “racial hatred” tells me you aren’t listening, so I saw no need to respond.

and I wasn’t saying the asking for evidence was postemodern, it was the “I’m justified in disagreeing” line… but what I was saying about evidence was that it was irrelevant in this case because Romero was not making a claim that could be proven or disproven by evidence. You continue to act as if he was.

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

You were the first one to use that line or argument in defense of this post, I was more mocking that line of argument. I am using racial hatred as short hands for “negative implicit stereotypes and attitudes”.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

“racial hatred” is not at all a suitable short hand for that

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

Would you prefer plain old ignorance instead?

Most stereotypes and attitudes come from either racial hatred or just being an ignorant prat.

Take your pick

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

they originally come from those sources, but the user of said stereotypes doesn’t need to have invented them, or even understand where they came from, or what they signify

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

yes – thus he qualifies as an ignorant twat (falling into my 95% category)

As someone who has been a direct (verbal) victim of numerous stereotypes and inherent racial hatreds for being jewish – let me tell you – where it comes from doesn’t make it any easier to handle

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

oh, no question.

I’m saying that the environment of stereotypes is such that people often employ them without themselves being personally bigoted, or even aware that what they’ve said or thought is at all problematic… consider people who think of Jewish people as racially “smarter”—I know such people, who would otherwise be shocked at the idea that they hold racialized beliefs, and who in fact have worked a lot in anti-racist activities, but their thinking is affected

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks, said better than by me. And 100% agree on ‘race card’.

by The Howling Fantods on Aug 30, 2011 9:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

I’m not entirely convinced that the booing is actually about race, but I don’t like arguments along the lines of ’it’s not racism, because it happens to white people, too!’. I personally am made uncomfortable when a ton of white people are booing a black guy, but that may just be my own personal issue.

The fan base’s adjectives used to describe Brown and Pence borders on mild racism at times, though. I.E. ‘lazy’, ‘uncaring’, etc. v. ‘gritty’, ‘plays the game the right way’, etc. (I know this has been discussed ad nauseum elsewhere) This doesn’t impugn the fan base as a whole, nor does it mean that everyone who praises Pence this way is guilty of mild racism. However, ‘lazy’ as a descriptor for Brown cannot be dismissed as not racism, given that it is not factually accurate and is a common stereotype of black people in general.

This treatment of Brown in the media and elsewhere make me suspicious that a non-trivial amount of the hostility is race-based, but to what extent is the unknown.

by The Howling Fantods on Aug 30, 2011 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

also, it’s important to remember that the structure of racism is such, and the pervasiveness of stereotypes is such, that a person doesn’t need to be personally bigoted to sort of automatically apply racial/racist stereotypes, especially labels like “lazy”, etc

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 9:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

It’s an insidious motherfucker.

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

did you guys read all the other threads at this blog about this very topic? why continue to be shocked and appalled every time it comes up? It shouldn’t be that surprising… the arguments made in those threads still obtain here.

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

I have read the arguments elsewhere in threads and actually agree on the issue of “Lazy” versus “Grit”. The question was whether in this particular instance is best explained by race. I argued no and as I said above… is there evidence that could convince you that this is not about race? If not… then you are not making a falsifiable claim…

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Took a weird turn and reached for the race card out of no where. What the fuck?

by nastyem on Aug 30, 2011 9:27 AM EDT reply actions  

Nicely written, and utterly horrifying. I imagine nobody was more firmly in the “what the FUCK?!?” headspace than Brown himself.

by dajafi on Aug 30, 2011 9:37 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Totally gripping and completely sad to read. Poor guy.

by Trev223 on Aug 30, 2011 9:44 AM EDT reply actions  

I really hope he forgets this last month or so and comes back next year strong.

by gingerredboy on Aug 30, 2011 9:49 AM EDT reply actions  

Sucking is irrelevant to the shade of one’s melanin.

by philshelp on Aug 30, 2011 10:34 AM EDT reply actions  

He has a .400+ OBP since his demotion. Explain to me how that qualifies as “sucking.”

by FuquaManuel on Aug 30, 2011 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

If he was white it would be .450+ /s

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

Sucking in one game. People at the ballpark tend to have a short memory.

I haven't died. Right now I'm drinking a beer and eating fried chicken. What were you expecting, a funeral?- Yao Ming

by joetimek on Aug 30, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

ManyPeople at the ballpark tend to have a short memorybe drunk and kind of stupid

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

I have a dream…not on the color of their skin but by the strength of their Bat and Glove…

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

Which it truly usually is in my opinion, they didn’t boo Dom cause of his skin tone (it seems) they booed him cause he was god awful last night (it seems)

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

Are you kidding?

When I go to the ballpark, drinking enhances my intelligence. In fact, my Beers/HowmanytimeImentionxFIP ratio skyrockets after a few Bud Light Limes.

Frankly, I think the short-memoried sober folks need to drink more.

I haven't died. Right now I'm drinking a beer and eating fried chicken. What were you expecting, a funeral?- Yao Ming

by joetimek on Aug 30, 2011 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

And Grimace gets hotter

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

I have a thing for purple.

I haven't died. Right now I'm drinking a beer and eating fried chicken. What were you expecting, a funeral?- Yao Ming

by joetimek on Aug 30, 2011 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

That should be the other way around. Fuck.

I haven't died. Right now I'm drinking a beer and eating fried chicken. What were you expecting, a funeral?- Yao Ming

by joetimek on Aug 30, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

to be fair, based on Romero’s description, “sucking” seems like an almost generous description of Brown’s performance last night. If ANYBODY— even Utley (maybe)— had a doubleheader performance like that for the big league team, they would be booed off the field just as badly. It’s just how things go, whether it’s fair or not.

by TMcAllister on Aug 30, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m on the fence about that. I think certain guys get a pass. If Utley had a night that bad, I bet he wouldn’t get booed, nor would Halladay or Lee, and I don’t think Vic would. There are clearly a few different thresholds that need to be reached depending upon fan perception of the player.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ok, but this is essentially Brown’s “rookie year.” If Utley had committed four errors and struck out four times (or whatever) in one day back in 2003, he would probably been booed as well.

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed, and IMO, his threshold would remain lower for the rest of his career (first impressions, and all).

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

I guess I don’t get this at all; shouldn’t you be less likely to boo a rookie? I’d agree some guys would get a pass, but why would a rookie not get one?

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

In the minds of the idiot brigade, Brown has not proven he is good enough to be worth all the hype. When he fails, it must be because he’s a waste of time.

Utley, on the other hand, has shown over the years that he really is good, and therefore isn’t booed.

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

I get the Utley exception, and I follow what you’re saying, but I just don’t get it. And I realize we’re talking idiots, so there’s likely nothing to “get”. On the other hand, I think it’s interesting that one of the defenses of the booing (and arguments against it being racial) is that, he had a shitty game, of course they booed him! As if we reserve the right for idiots to boo, but we don’t want them accused of racism.

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, I think once it crosses into accusations of racism, the booing then goes from the relatively innocuous territory of acting stupidly into the far more malicious territory of actively hating someone because of his race. It seems to me fair for people to try to draw that distinction.

Either way, the booing is dumb, but in one case it’s driven by something much uglier than frustration with a bad play.

by TMcAllister on Aug 30, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, he had a shitty game. And another shitty game. And he was demoted. And he hasn’t performed as well as Mike Stanton or Jason Heyward (last year) or some other recent highly touted prospects, so he is on a terribly short leash.

It’s not just one game, it’s a year and a half, according to the idiots.

And I’m sure there is an element of racisim there, I just don’t think it’’s as prevalent as some do.

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I shouldn’t have said “anybody.” In Philly, I’ve known three guys who have had lifetime passes — Dawkins, Utley, and now Lee. I’ve even heard people rip on Halladay unfairly (believe it or not, the consensus at the bar when he left the game with heatstroke was that Halladay was soft).

In Brown’s case, though, he’s done little (so far) to build up the goodwill necessary to act as a buffer for the folks who want to boo him so badly.

by TMcAllister on Aug 30, 2011 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think we’re saying the same thing differently.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sure, but Utley, for example, earned his “lifetime pass.” He earned it by hitting 30 homeruns.

Brown hasn’t (yet).

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's not doing it the right way

by Walcott on Aug 30, 2011 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

well written story, up until the point

where the writer pulled race into it. it sounds to me like he didn’t get booed until he had made MANY mistakes all in the same day.

by waltpsu on Aug 30, 2011 10:46 AM EDT reply actions  

My issue has always been the viciousness of said booing. That’s something you can only testify to if you’ve experienced it firsthand. Sometimes there’s an undercurrent, something you can’t quite put your finger on, and it just makes it feel that much more sinister/targeted.

You can’t say definitively that race is a part of most things, but you can’t say that is isn’t, either. To quote a song, “Everyone’s a little bit racist.”

What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.

by doubleh on Aug 30, 2011 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but not on big things, little things like why can’t waiters learn to speak god damn english /s.

To me philadelphia booing is most often related to (unrealistic) expectations – usually connected to how much a player makes (see Iguodala, Andre) or just stupid draft night lingering (see McNabb, Donovan)

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Crushing Dom's Confidence

I think we are missing the biggest question of all. Do the Phillies crush his confidence some more and not bring him up as one of the first September call-ups?

by Adam Gladstone on Aug 30, 2011 11:05 AM EDT reply actions  

If this is a big question than Domonic Brown lacks the mental fortitude to play professional sports anyway.

This is not a ‘big question’ – it’s a WIP question

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Very well written

The only unfortunate thing about the booing aside is that it derailed some of the conversation. It always amazes me when people say race doesn’t matter, then generate 800 posts about it. Part of me hopes Brown doesn’t get the call up and is able to get away for a bit and relieve some pressure. Of course, even better would be if he gets the call up, crushes it, and puts doubts to rest for the winter. Whatever the source of the booing, I figure he’s stuck with it for the rest of his time in Philly.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 11:17 AM EDT reply actions  

I figure he’s stuck with it for the rest of his time in Philly.

Play well, booing stops.

It’s a pretty simple concept

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Tell that to Schmidt, McNabb, Iggy, Hamels, Lindross, or any of the other good to great players who never totally escaped it.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

Does Cole Hamels get booed a lot these days?

He got booed during what most perceived as a ‘bad’ season (because they judge on wins and losses and listen to WIP and ESPN) but it seems he’s quite popular these days (he’s also realtively cheap – isn’t he in line for a raise)

They’ll escape a lot of it.

And if it bothers them, again, they shouldn’t be in professional sports anyway. Fans boo – it’s what they do – for some it makes them feel better – get over it – stop ascribing it to anything other than people being idiots. 95% of people are idiots and morons

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

I’m not ascribing to anything more venomous than stupidity (which is plenty damning on its own). Hamels doesn’t get booed, but as I said above, he’s certainly on a shorter leash than Lee, Oswalt or Halladay due to certain fans perceiving him as being too weak, not gritty enough, whatever. I’m merely arguing that certain players are more prone to be booed because fans have some preconceived notion that says he isn’t playing the Philly way or whatever.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

Some people are just waiting for a chance to boo Hamels. He’s “not Philly enough” so he doesn’t get to be fully in the club. At a game a couple months ago, he came out in the bottom of the 7th for a pinch hitter - the Phils were either down 1-0 or 2-1- and the guy behind me screams, “That god damn Hamels is too weak to even throw a complete game!” And, man, the things people say in bars about him the moment he gets into trouble…

It’s weird, because even though the narrative of Philly fans is that we love a winner, that’s pretty much just not true. Philly fans love a winner, provided that he also has a specific set of acceptable personal characteristics. I always feel like he gets a conditional pass from fans; as long as he’s good, they’ll tolerate his non-Philliness.

by TMcAllister on Aug 30, 2011 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

I guess I messed something up— that line that’s crossed out should not be crossed out.

by TMcAllister on Aug 30, 2011 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

They love a winner when he’s winning

If the phillies were winning the man behind you probably doesn’t scream, probably compliments Cole for a job well done.

Again – 95% morons – it’s easier that way

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

and if you’re being booed because you’re not the second coming of Roberto Clemente, then you’re pretty screwed.

by perfectdepth on Aug 30, 2011 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

This is my view… I think the laziness vs. grit thing is just racism for sure, but last night I don’t think you need Race to explain the booing.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe they were just booing having to be in Lehigh?

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

Not to mention having that sentiment immortalized in a Billy Joel song. That’s gotta suck as much as that song.

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well they’re booing him in Allentown
For the baseballs that he never found
For the promises that BA gave
If he worked hard
If he just played.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

it’s eerie how well that just works

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

in the context of the thread that is.

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also

F you jreed for getting that damned song stuck in my head.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don’t forget the “sounds of the mill” percussion effects.

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hey,
Some Pain Will Last.

\m/\m/\m/m\m/\m/\m/\m/\m/\m/ \m/\m/\m/\m/\m/\m/\m/\m/\m/

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, this is exactly my feeling. I mean, the biggest sign that the cliche critiques (laziness, not being serious, bad attitude, etc. etc. ) are race-based is that they’re demonstrably untrue, by all accounts. The only reason to say that kind of thing is if you’re applying idiotic race logic to players.
It doesn’t help that his replacement (Pence) is a guy who fits exactly the Great White Throwback stereotype.

But as far as I can tell, based on the description of the game, Brown got booed because he played like an overmatched, overhyped (and the hype is definitely a factor) bum, at least for a day.

by TMcAllister on Aug 30, 2011 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rec'd

Wasn’t there but I can’t imagine any other response from the fans for a 4-error, 4 dropped-fly-ball performance, sweetened with four strikeouts. Really. And from a guy who’s been twice in The Show.

Maybe the booing would’ve been a little lighter if Dom was white but hey, play like that and you have to expect that. I really doubt race played a role initially, but perhaps it crept in as things went from bad to worse for him.

Dom has not achieved the consistency yet that he needs, but if he repeats Aug 29th, even if he does he won’t get credit for it from parts of the fanbase. I feel bad for the guy, and would for any player with similar expectations that had this bad of a game.

by Georgia_Flyer on Aug 31, 2011 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

This- I actually doubt that a white player in his position (highly touted prospect, who is still believed to be a prominent part of the organization’s future, but has been sent down and is suffering through a crapacious game) would have been treated much better. I am white, and had I been there, I may have booed Brown’s performance, or at least groaned more than a little as it got worse and worse. But it would have had nothing to do with the color of his skin, and EVERYTHING to do with his performance.

"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."

by dannijd on Sep 4, 2011 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

This. Rec’d. That’s why while I knew some people would get their backs up about Romero mentioning the racial element, it’s not at all out of place in a story about Dom.

by PhillyFriar on Aug 30, 2011 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks for this writeup. Has Brown always had these issues in the field? I’m certainly not the most well-informed fan about our minor leaguers, far from it. But, in following Brown in the minors, I always heard about his athleticism and his bat, but never heard that he was horrible in the field. But this can’t be a new issue, can it?

by David S. Cohen on Aug 30, 2011 11:27 AM EDT reply actions  

I’d always heard he was “raw” in the field, but that people expected his athleticism and teachability would help him overcome that

by yolacrary on Aug 30, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

This. Plus Left Field is pretty new to him, so he’s a pretty average defender having to adjust to a new position.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, honestly since I’ve been sort of ‘dabbling’ this season I didn’t even know about the position switch until today.

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Phillies have pulled many strange switches in AAA this year, this one actually makes sense, long term. Frankly, they should have done some of this last year, as I think Dom was destined for Left eventually, anyway.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh I’m not disputing it makes sense – I just didn’t know about it until today :)

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

So did Brown come to baseball later in life? I mean was it his first love, or was he a multi-sport athlete who opted to play baseball…if that makes any sense. From his fielding woes I’d guess the latter. Alot of his mistakes seem more rooted in stituational awareness, stuff that develops from playing the game enough to be exposed to the myraid of different fielding scenarios.

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

He had a commitment to Miami to play wide receiver when he was drafted, but ultimately signed with the Phillies.

by The Howling Fantods on Aug 30, 2011 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks. That explains it. .

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Partially. It’s not like he just suddenly started playing after getting drafted. He didn’t specialize, but he certainly isn’t a neophyte either.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well yeah that’s why I mentioned how he struggles with the stituational aspects of fielding which requires more playing time and something his athleticism can’t completely compensate for.

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wasn’t Brown recruited to play WR for U Miami?

by Romero on Aug 30, 2011 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m no expert on Dom Brown, but I did see him play a game in Reading early last summer in which he also just missed a ball hit to him (in right field). On that night, he made a few other plays, one in which he charged a ground ball hit to him and fired a complete bullet to home to nail a runner trying to score.

On the whole, that night Brown seemed like he had the potential to be a very good right fielder, the one miscue being a ball hit to him that he just inexplicably missed.

After last night (and watching him play defense for the Phils), I’m really not sure what to make of Brown’s defense, or how to explain where the struggles come from.

by Romero on Aug 30, 2011 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Amaro thinks Brown is doing an adequate job.

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 11:42 AM EDT reply actions  

I was not at CCP last night nor did I watch or even listen to the game, so I am not going to speculate on any racial motivations from that particular crowd. Though I honestly do wonder what reaction Pence would have gotten if he fell on his ass at CBP like he did last night.

However, I will say that as a whole, I believe a lot of the hatred comes from simply a lack of patience on the part of people. PhillyFriar and myself talked about this a bit on Twitter last night, but Phillies fans as a whole are a really impatient group of people. Remember last year when everyone (by everyone, I mean mostly the WIP crowd) was clamoring for Domonic Brown to be called up? And the standing ovation he got in his first MLB plate appearance?

Now look. Because he did not storm onto the scene like Ryan Howard did in 2005 or Jason Heyward did last year (though admittedly Heyward has his own problems now), Brown is a bust and a bum. Ryan Howard was 25 when he made his debut. Same with Chase Utley. Dom Brown is 23, turning 24 this Saturday. At this point all I can do is preach patience. Dom Brown is not there yet, I think we all know that. But if he can get there, the pot at the end of the rainbow is filled with gold. Pure gold. Not to mention he is cost-controlled now and even when he struggles with the bat, he still has the ability to work a walk as evidenced by his OBP.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Aug 30, 2011 11:49 AM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Rec'd

For the Heyward analogy. Tore it up last year, for a rookie. Now he’s having troubles, man. Troubles.

by Georgia_Flyer on Aug 31, 2011 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Perhaps the biggest difference between Brown and Howard/ Utley is this- Howard and Utley came up closer to when they were truly ready (and perhaps to a certain extent were held back by players in the majors blocking their assent. This made them perhaps all the more ready when they got to play for the team- and neither really played every day at first.

Brown on the other and, came up, particularly this year and was thrust into playing every day, even though he was probably not ready to be there (something Smuggles has consistently said). He is also coming onto a team in win-now mode, something that Utley and Howard had the luxury of not dealing with. My wish for him is that he develops and matures in AAA, and that his next call up comes because HE is ready- not because there are injuries/ineffectiveness in the outfield.

"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."

by dannijd on Sep 4, 2011 7:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

LHV is in the midst of a playoff push, and got shoutout in a double header. Their LF dropped/misplayed 3-4 balls his way, so why is it a big shock that fans were booing? Maybe the fans were upset that the LF that previously manned his position when Brown was in the majors would have made most of those plays? Why does it have to be about something else?

by cyhamels on Aug 30, 2011 12:06 PM EDT reply actions  

So there was a lot of white people, at a game in the Lehigh Valley, to watch minor league baseball, which included 1 African American player on the starting home roster. Those same people booed said player for making several defensive mistakes and struggling at the plate.

I guess I need to change the batteries in my Racism Detector.

"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
His Name is Mudd
@boknows71

by boknows71 on Aug 30, 2011 12:17 PM EDT reply actions  

I really don’t understand what you’re trying to say here.

by phatj on Aug 30, 2011 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Where’s the racism?

Are fans not allowed to boo poor play?

"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
His Name is Mudd http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo-WjUjzV_Q
@boknows71

by boknows71 on Aug 30, 2011 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

WholeCamels said it best above, I think. Seeing as we were not there, it is impossible to conclude whether or not that crowd last night had any racial motivations. However, in the past, there have been some criticisms of Brown that certainly suggest racism. So knowing that, it is understandable how someone at last night’s game might suggest that or see it that way.

What satisfaction would you get in booing a 23-year old kid having a rough game in the minor leagues, anyway? Regardless of skin color, booing players on your own team makes no sense.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Aug 30, 2011 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Regardless of skin color, booing players on your own team makes no sense.

Does fanaticism ever make sense?

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Especially not sporting fanaticism.

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Touche.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Aug 30, 2011 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

The proper terminology is touché pussycat

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed. I’ve actually never booed a Philly player in person. I’ve read some the riot act but that is in the comfort of my own home.

"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
His Name is Mudd http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo-WjUjzV_Q
@boknows71

by boknows71 on Aug 30, 2011 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I don’t boo – but i yell (at the tv)

Last year – giants game – i was convinced desean jacksons show boating was going to get his ass tackled

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Giants were too busy blaming the Punter.

"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
His Name is Mudd http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo-WjUjzV_Q
@boknows71

by boknows71 on Aug 30, 2011 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

I yelled at the freaking instant replay – every time

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I never screamed at the tv louder in my life than when DeSean was standing was running along the goal line.

Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.

That is all.

by EREX21 on Aug 30, 2011 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think I said something that rhymes with “goalie wit.”

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

I booed the shit out of David Bell some years ago

to the point where his wife (didn’t know who she was) got up and left.

I regret nothing, but then again, I’m racist against those types of people.

by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Aug 31, 2011 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

I booed him privately. I came clean with that the first time I met him.

by Cormican on Aug 31, 2011 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

I have no idea nor do I really care if racism is a part of this. If it is, shame on you for boon Brown for being Different than you. If it isn’t, shame on you for booing the kid for having a shitty game.

I can’t wait for his hamate to be healed, for his season to become next season for him and I look forward to his mashing homeruns making diving catches and becoming a superstar all the while quietly giving all the haters a big middle finger.

25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark

by Joecatz on Aug 30, 2011 12:55 PM EDT reply actions  

I can’t wait for his hamate to be healed, for his season to become next season for him and I look forward to his mashing homeruns making diving catches and becoming a superstar all the while quietly giving all the haters a big middle finger.

Ditto.

by David S. Cohen on Aug 30, 2011 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Really, it’s to the point of being laughable just how crappy the past 12 month have been to this kid. Between organizational miscues, injuries, overhype, the Mayberry conundrum, pence, demotions, etc… Can anyone really think of anything else that can happen to this kid?

Seriously. Give him a break. I hope he doesn’t make the post season roster, cause god forbid he makes one miscue, it’ll be he’ll for years to come.

Also, pence looked like a little leaguer in RF last night himself.

25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark

by Joecatz on Aug 30, 2011 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I actually want him on the post-season roster, just so he can have a chance to prove the idiots wrong now. One “clutch” homerun and POW! That’ll shut a few people up.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Aug 30, 2011 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

And one ‘unclutch’ strike out (or walk – cause youknow – clutch at bats cant end in walks) and they crow louder

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah that’s where I was headed but with a fielding error.

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Kinda like when Howard K’d to end the LCS last year.

Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.

That is all.

by EREX21 on Aug 30, 2011 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

on the other hand— one moment of perceived unclutchiness (which, I’d guess, would even include taking a walk because that’s “passive” and a sign that “he’s afraid to swing the bat”) in the playoffs would increase that contingent’s volume tenfold.

by TMcAllister on Aug 30, 2011 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

looks like I was 1 minute too late.

by TMcAllister on Aug 30, 2011 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s the one thing I always found fascinating – people hating bobby abreu cause he didn’t swing at pitches out of the strike zone

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Padding his walks.

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

So unclutch

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Only worried about his own stats. Team players swing.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s how you get STD’s tough

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sounds like it should be a stat in this context.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

People with hustle and grit swing at balls out of the strike zone.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree with you totally, except then opposite is much more likely to happen.

I’m gonna laugh next summer when he makes the all star team.

25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark

by Joecatz on Aug 30, 2011 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m gonna laugh next summer when he makes the all star team.

And comments like this are why he gets booed at one minor league game

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

I doubt that it actually has anything to do with comments like that.

by taco pal on Aug 30, 2011 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

no, he gets booed because he makes a bunch of errors and K’s four times, or because he’s black, and some fans are just assholes/racist assholes. Take your pick.

I doubt those of us who have faith in him and hope he comes back and tears it up to spite those who throw stones have anything to do with it at all.

25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark

by Joecatz on Sep 1, 2011 9:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

Good afternoon everyone!

Thanks, TGP Editors, for front-paging this article. I’m really happy so many TGP readers have taken it in and are responding. These are some of the conversations that I hoped it would start.

More than anything, however, after watching the game last night I knew that I had to write about it. It was too much of a moment to let pass by without expressing for myself, and for sharing with others.

I see other writers (the Morning Call’s Bill White, and also John Finger, and, to a lesser degree, CSN Philly) have weighed in on last night’s events as well.

After sleeping on it (I wrote this piece in Philadelphia around 2-3 am after driving back from Allentown), I still want Dom Brown to succeed even more now, and that hope is undeniably colored, as so many things are (let’s get real about this), by my awareness of racial tensions.

It’s true that I can’t say for certain how much of the booing was motivated by race problems, but I also think that to deny the possibility that the booing was racially motivated is to reveal your own insensitivities to these problems. And these denials probably only make things worse.

On a related note, I’m really happy I have seen so much disparaging of the expression “playing the race card”. Good grief. Something bell hooks wrote about this has always stuck with me. She notes how “this very expression trivializes discussions of racism, implying that it’s all just a game”.

Something I love about The Good Phight (aptly named!) is its hard work in not trivializing things, but to look fully at most things and see the complexity in them.

by Romero on Aug 30, 2011 1:26 PM EDT reply actions  

I think constantly harping on racial issues makes it worse… i.e. the people who obsess about this stuff and become fixated on these issues tend to act in a more racist and uncomfortable manner when interacting with others races. I can send you the numerous studies that have been done to support this point.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 2:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

What is a “real issue of racism”? And who decides that?

by Romero on Aug 30, 2011 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rush Limbaugh?

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

As I said above… I don’t think you need race as an explanatory variable here. I think Brown’s poor playing does a fine job of explaining this reaction. I do think that the use of the word “:Lazy” and such throughout his career is likely to have some racism too it. I guess when I run the counterfactual in my head I don’t think that if a white dude was out there he would have been spared from the boos or the boos would have been any more severe.

I think brining up the issue of race in situations like this trivializes cases of real prejudice.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also I am not condoning booing your own players or especially booing Dom… it sucks that is happing too him and I hope he doesn’t get a chip on his shoulder any bigger than he already had. I just don’t see the race issue at play here. Although the people may be racist their negative reaction is over-determined in this case… making it a terrible situation to observe people’s racism.

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sounds very

Roman.

“… and let me point out that this sale is strictly voluntary, Trinity forces no one to participate against his wishes, this is the great glory of Trinity…”

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is that the chocolate war movie?

One of my most favorite books of my childhood

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Indeed. And like the book, the movie is also excellent.

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

For years i’ve wanted the soundtrack to that movie and haven’t been able to find a godo listing

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Soundtrack is also excellent.

Hey did you see Battle: Los Angeles. I got it for 50 cents and didn’t last 30 minutes. If you saw it , is there anything worth while to sit thru the rest of it or should I just cut my losses.

by j reed on Aug 30, 2011 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have not seen it yet – i’ll wait until it’s on some cable probably – i’ll watch it for eckhardt but that’s about it

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s kinda meh.

Try it again, but this time, drink more.

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

What did Dom do to deserve this? It’s just so cruel and unfair.

Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.

That is all.

by EREX21 on Aug 30, 2011 2:32 PM EDT reply actions  

They build ‘em up so’s they can tear ’em down.

What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.

by doubleh on Aug 30, 2011 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

He chose to play professional sports

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

He was released in stores as The Shiny New Toy before manufacturers had worked out the kinks.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Aug 30, 2011 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Microsoft made hiM?

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Personally, I think booing is a compliment. You only have reason to boo players for which you have expectations. It would be more disconcerting if he weren’t booed for his described play; it would mean that people thought that was his true talent level.

I would also say that while I don’t attend minor league games, I think my expectations are all out of whack vis a vis the minors versus the majors. I have this idea in my head that a major leaguer playing in the minors ought to be able to hit .500 and put up other gaudy numbers. This is clearly not the case in reality. If this is true of other people and they think of Dom as a major leaguer than they would expect him to be leaps and bounds better than anyone else on the field. ie more expectations that he inevitably won’t live up to.

by pretzalz on Aug 30, 2011 4:23 PM EDT reply actions  

Does anyone boo you at work when you under perform?

Your fallacy that ‘booing is a compliment’ is nonsense – ask JD Drew

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think you completely debunked the theory with that. Though I don’t completely agree with Pretzalz, you don’t boo a person that you legitimately don’t give a crap about them. What’s worse than negative attention is complete indifference. People boo him because they have incredibly high expectations that he hasn’t quite lived up to yet. I don’t view it as a compliment, nor do I view it as an insult, but a twisted form of showing a disappointment. There’s a difference between booing a guy like Drew(because you hate him) and booing a guy like Dom(because he hasn’t been the second coming he was promised to be.)This is not me saying I approve of booing however, this is just how I interpret this booing.

It's only gonna get funner

by VanceinmyPants on Aug 30, 2011 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

A better comp, would be that one asks for their money back because their Big Mac is overcooked. But if I go to one of Bobby Flay’s restaurants and get an overcooked burger, I’m asking for my damned money back.

It’s shaky logic.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

You don’t boo the line cook?

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mcdonalds has cooks? I thought they had robots

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bobby Flay’s = McDonalds?

(seriously, I don’t know what Bobby Flay is).

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bobby Flay

Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.

That is all.

by EREX21 on Aug 30, 2011 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Huh. Never heard of him.

Thanks, though. Anyone who opens a place called “Bobby’s Burger Palace” deserves my patronage.

by Phrozen on Aug 31, 2011 2:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

If I underperformed I’d expect someone to take me aside privately to voice their concerns. When random fans can do that with professional athletes I’ll get back to you. And I don’t understand the JD Drew counterexample. Are you suggesting that he is not a good baseball player[or at least was]?

To be perfectly honest, I am not the type of person that would boo any athlete. I was just rationalizing in the universe of players that do get booed which certainly exists they are almost invariably athletes either expected to be good, or were good in the past.

by pretzalz on Aug 30, 2011 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m suggesting that booing him had nothing to do with performance

If fans were capable of judging a players performance at a good level I’d probably allow you the ‘booing’ concept – but most fans (again, 95%) are idiots

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 30, 2011 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think you made five posts, and of those five, three of them called 95% of fans idiots. Attention to TGP, he means thereby this entire community! And “if fans were capable of judging a players performance at a good level”, what’s the good level? One to which you would deem good?

Whether it’s fair or not, there were expectations placed on Dominic Brown and he’s statistically played little better than Raul Ibanez. I don’t think his high OBP% eliminates his relative underachievements in other fields. His lack of defense and power.

Is it too early to judge what his career will be? Of course, but fans are idiots for lamenting his underachievement relative to his hype this season? Yes, he’s a raw athletic specimen but does that automatically mean he’ll translate?

He may just be one of those guys who excels in the minor leagues and ends up just being average in the bigs. Or he could be a star, nobody knows including you SportingFanaticism.

And in regards to the Iguodala thing, see unlike in MLB, the NBA has a salary cap. Teams can’t go over a certain number, with the exceptions of MLE/LLE/Injury exceptions and bird rights.

I made a post on Libertyballers on Iguodala’s shortcomings, I’ll just give you the rundown: 14 million dollars is not worth 7 RPG.(Since that’s pretty much the only extraordinary statistic out of Iguodala. Outside of the DWS).

Iguodala should be making 6 million dollars less(8 million), if he were the Sixers would be at least 12 million under the current cap. That number could’ve potentially increased with the new CBA and an Eagles-like situation could’ve presented itself to the Sixers.

Unfortunately, including this year we’ve got two more years of this contract to go on(going off Iguodala’s statements, he’s well aware he’s not getting this money again and will take the player option).

So excuse us(and me) for being idiots and lamenting that the Sixers franchise for 3-5 years is stuck at either mediocrity or worse yet rock bottom.

Now, to the case of racism: Michael Vick has become in effect the new de-facto sports face of Philly. He’s no more whiter than McNabb or Brown or Utley, etc. So why? Because we have no choice? Nice Theory, but in reality it’s because when guys produce, we feel good. When they don’t, then we let em have it.

Allen Iverson, the guy had his off and on the court baggage. And yet, the fans loved him! And to be sure, Iverson had his fair share of detractors inside the city. But these detractors were what, 15-20% of Philly(1/4th of the town?)

Also, Repetition breeds familarity. If Brown showed insistences of his potential, then fans will become more receptive. The town loves Jrue Holiday after knowing next to nothing about the UCLA product, why? Because he’s produced and on a consistent basis. And again, the guy doesn’t look like a snowflake.

Your cries for racism aren’t cries for racism, they’re excuses for your beloved Dominic Brown. Supporting him during these tough times is a fan’s job, making excuses belittles his major league career and will actually help him towards the bust pathway.

by LeQuan Glover on Aug 30, 2011 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

But these detractors were what, 15-20% of Philly(1/4th of the town?)

You need work on your fractions.

"Miami can’t beat Chicago, why? Because Chicago has everything Miami has and more.... I’ll grant you Wade/James stealing a game, or maybe two. But we’re seeing an OKC/CHI finals, and that’s a finals everyone will tune in for." - LeQuan Glover

by yosoysean on Aug 30, 2011 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I love how he managed to squeeze in an irrelevant Iguodala bashing.

"I admire his competitiveness. As much as I admire it, I thought that he was trying too hard."- Eddie Jordan

by jefu on Aug 30, 2011 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not really. I’ve trained my eyes to search for key words.

"I admire his competitiveness. As much as I admire it, I thought that he was trying too hard."- Eddie Jordan

by jefu on Aug 30, 2011 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

I red it. I lost a few IQ pionts in the proces.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Aug 30, 2011 11:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Me dids also too. More drink!

by Phrozen on Aug 31, 2011 2:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

I’m sure he gets it right 1/3 of the time (50%).

by Cormican on Aug 31, 2011 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

What?

Attention to TGP, he means thereby this entire community!

What?

…Dominic Brown…

Dom O nic…

His lack of defense and power.

That is not a sentence.

Your cries for racism aren’t cries for racism…

What?

…Dominic…

What has two ’o’s and is better at spelling than you? DomOnic Brown!

by Phrozen on Aug 31, 2011 2:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

Actually

I called 95% of people idiots.

And thank you for proving my point OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 31, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

So your comment was even worse, why is this guy not banned from sports communities or as targetted as I myself?

And I thought that spelling on the internet was put on a backburner for the most part, so long as one can comprehend the sentences and points made. Or has that rule also been waived for me?

So I made a typo 20%=1/5, what of it? The point is, those so-called racist sports fans in Philadelphia are a minority. So you’re now going to judge 80% of the fanbase due to the actions of 20%?

That would be very fitting for the majority of you, you complain that you, the-so called die hard are in the minority. But should anyone try to mingle with you if they don’t have a grasp on your ideals or theories, they’re a dumb sports fan or an idiot.

The whole point of my message which is being missed is stop making up every excuse in the book for Domonic Brown and realize the kid(at least this season) isn’t what you thought he was.

by LeQuan Glover on Aug 31, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

SF and I have argued in the past and we don’t agree on everything, but I don’t think either of us considers the other an idiot. We can have cohesive, well thought arguments that we just don’t agree on. The reason there is a different standard is that SF has been posting long enough that we all know he isn’t an idiot. You’ve only be posting long enough to provide evidence you might be.

by Cormican on Aug 31, 2011 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Can I get the Cormican report card on my TGP performance so far?

"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
His Name is Mudd http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo-WjUjzV_Q
@boknows71

by boknows71 on Aug 31, 2011 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Eh, I didn’t word that right. I was pretty tired and didn’t really convey quite the meaning I meant to.

Oh, and you’re alright in my book.

by Cormican on Sep 1, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Nice to see you stil can’t take your own don’t be an ass advice to heart

If you've got some hopelessly overmatched heroes fighting evil and some Imperial types marching, John Williams is your guy. You need a song to make people reach for a box of Kleenex, talk to Randy Newman. But if you want creepy atmospherics and spine-shivering chords to back up your casual death threats, you gotta bring in Danny Elfman

by SportingFanaticism on Aug 31, 2011 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Would you two just get a room already?

by Cormican on Sep 1, 2011 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

If Mayberry keeps up his playberry the wayberry he is now, he’s gonna stayberry. And Dom Brown will be traded awayberry. #ThatShitCrayberry

Bullies, Phightins, and Vickerbockers

by DannyMcG on Aug 30, 2011 4:31 PM EDT reply actions  

This post is crapberry.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Would you like some crapberry jam on your shit sandwich?

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I thought of the same thing. Probably my favorite scene in that movie.

by Cormican on Aug 30, 2011 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Can I boo this post?

What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.

by doubleh on Aug 30, 2011 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

NO

Bullies, Phightins, and Vickerbockers

by DannyMcG on Aug 30, 2011 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

by Phrozen on Aug 30, 2011 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

/throws battery

What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.

by doubleh on Aug 30, 2011 6:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Stop it!

I blame psychos who have a pathological need to invest way too much animus in, what others might call, “pastime” or “entertainment”….I’m looking at y’all! Stop it! Stop doing that! Just stop!
/Bob Newhart

"He's a bum...this one stinks...this jerk can't play."-- A father teaching his daughter the Phillies lineup from the program roster, the Vet, c.1998

by MikeEinNC on Aug 30, 2011 6:22 PM EDT reply actions  

Stop it or I’ll bury you alive in a box!

by Cole_Hamels_Can on Aug 30, 2011 7:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

I ain't touching the race thing.

But news like this makes me pull even harder for Domonic Brown.

For me, I don’t get particularly angry when a player goes through a cold streak or has other problems. Yes, it is annoying when it affects the outcome of a game or a season, but I start rooting for them more and more throughout their problems (maybe that explains my great love for Raul Ibanez and Joe Blanton) and I’m more worried about them as the person rather than the player. Only a pinhead would assume it doesn’t bother them far more than it bothers us.

Poor Dom Brown was Ruben’s panic move last year and in one way or another, he’s been paying for it ever since. I hope the organization gives him support through his trouble (the trials of Brett Myers in 2008 come to mind) and he comes back stronger than ever.

I haven’t seen any video or heard any audio, but if it was half as bad last night as it reads, those idiots in the stands should never be allowed near sporting events ever again. Yeah, it’s okay to boo a botched play or express consternation with a bad AB, but if it’s true that the crowd’s asshattery just grew through the game, there’s no justification for such bad behavior.

Those babies are probably the first to cry about how we as a fanbase are perceived in the national spotlight.

by Sisko on Aug 30, 2011 6:48 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m generally leery of ascribing racism to anything unless it’s really obvious -it’s a serious charge to make. That said, is it possible some was at play? Sure. But I think in this case, it’s not racism so much as it is just a bunch of people expressing their displeasure with a kid who hasn’t done what people thought he would do. On the one hand, since that’s the only way to really let the player know what you think, I can understand it. On the other, it just makes it worse.

It frustrates me that too many people get their information from WIP and 97.5, having no idea that the major hosts on there are just talking out their asses when it comes to baseball. Dom just needs a year maybe two to fully heal and we’ll see what he can really do. Assuming he isn’t traded by an idiot GM in the meantime…

by Airedale260 on Aug 30, 2011 9:52 PM EDT reply actions  

Joecatz mentioned it above, but Dom Brown’s hamate bone fully healing is the best thing that could happen to Dom Brown right now. It’ll be awesome once he has his fully power back.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Aug 30, 2011 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

His OPS+ was 99 this year with the hamate. With some rest and a fully healed wrist, he could really crush it next year.

by Cormican on Aug 31, 2011 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

What amazes me is that NO ONE is mentioning it anymore. Not the announcers, not the beats, not management, no one. It’s like its been completely forgotten about and its probably the BIGGEST reason why hes struggled offensively, in terms of power and bat speed, which is in direct correlation to his SLG. percentage, HR’s, and to a lesser extent, average. His OBP as a ROOKIE was (and is) better than everyone on the team except Utley, Ruiz and Victorino when he was sent down, and likewise with BB/K rate.

I just….

…nevermind.

25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark

by Joecatz on Sep 1, 2011 9:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

People do not bother to do basic medical research and see how a hamate bone injury relates in the context to baseball. And some of those that did are quite forgetful. I guess people just assume that because he is playing everything is fine and he is 100% and he is fully healed and it is no longer affecting him on the baseball field.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Sep 2, 2011 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Another possible medical issue was mentioned in the comments of Bill White’s post. Someone suggested that D Brown may have a binocular vision problem. Seems worth looking into, if Domonic hasn’t already done so. It is a bit weird that so many lazy (not hustling) fly balls drop near a AAA/ML outfielder uncaught, even if it is a new position for him.

I felt like I thought it hit me - Chase Utley

by SandPhlea on Sep 7, 2011 5:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

That’s about as definitive as saying he may have some kind of bipedal deficiencies.

by Cormican on Sep 7, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

no

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Sep 8, 2011 2:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

Why are you so quick to discount it?

"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."

by dannijd on Sep 11, 2011 2:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

Another possible medical issue was mentioned in the comments of Bill White’s post. Someone suggested that D Brown may have a binocular vision problem. Seems worth looking into, if Domonic hasn’t already done so. It is a bit weird that so many lazy (not hustling) fly balls drop near a AAA/ML outfielder uncaught, even if it is a new position for him.

Who is this a person? An opthalmologist with 30 years of person? A 15-year old student? A hobo? You don’t know and have know way of knowing. Has he seen Dom Brown in person? From the tone of the post, it sounds like it is all speculative, in which case the answer to that is no. So why in fuck’s name should we take the word of someone whom we don’t even know is a doctor who is speculating about things he/she may know absolutely nothing about, and certainly has not examined him? Seriously, answer that question.

Maybe, he is just rough around the edges defensively (GASP!). Maybe he is trying to learn a new position (GASP!). Maybe he is 24-years old and still developing (GASP!). Maybe others have been in Dom Brown’s shoes in terms of defense and have gone to shine defensively like Chase Utley (GASP!). Maybe people speculating on medicine over the internet are not the most reliable sources on medicine (GASP!)

Seriously, woman. Use your fucking brain sometimes. It will do you good.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Sep 11, 2011 8:26 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

All I am saying is this- even in Right field, there were times when he looked quite clueless about where a ball coming at him is going to land. It very well may be that he is rough around the edges, but he would be far from the first (or the last) player whose fielding problems stemmed at least in part from a vision problem.

May I suggest that while I do not know who the poster is, or their background, you don’t either. The fact that they are suggesting that it is vision suggests to me that it is someone who either has dealt with the issue, either personally or professionally, or knows someone who has. The fact is that neither of us are doctors, nor to the best of my knowledge has either of us spent last night at a Holiday Inn Express. To just flatly say no assumes as many things about this situation as to say definitively that it is the issue. Keep an open mind, it will do you good as well.

"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."

by dannijd on Sep 13, 2011 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry

but race doesnt have anything to do with this. Tired of people bringing race into things where it shouldnt be.

by Easedel on Aug 31, 2011 2:41 AM EDT reply actions  

Spoken like a true white man. Way to stand up to all the unjust treatment you’ve faced in this country.

by taco pal on Aug 31, 2011 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Who Is Racist?

I’m not saying that Romero is racist, but when you witness a horrendous performance at a sporting event and people boo and you see a racial component you are not a color blind person. If you are really evolved you see people as people. That black people don’t show up for these games is not the fault of the white attendees. They saw a crazy wack performance and reacted appropriately. Would they have sat silently on their hands in racist solidarity if Dom had hit four home runs and fielded his position flawlessly?

by BySaam on Sep 1, 2011 1:16 AM EDT reply actions  

Your point is well taken…personally, I’m not a guy who is going to boo anybody. And I am sure I would have empathized with how painful this night was for Brown as Romero did. But at the same time, I bet that Dom was the guy that most of the paying customers were most interested in seeing!

Lee not running out that ball…he’s a pitcher and it rolled to the dude like a skeeball. If a position player of any color does that, it’s an issue.

As for gritty…the truth is that not too many African American cats are mad devoted to playing baseball and doing everything imaginable to make it in the sport. That’s why MLB has been fostering a program to try to revive interest among African Americans in playing baseball. Is it a crime to be a person with light skin who works his ass off to compensate for a lack of pure athletic ability to become relevant in a game that he truly loves?

But yes, of course, there is racism in our society, to be sure. I hear ya, and I’m sure that it makes its way into some people’s perception of baseball.

by BySaam on Sep 2, 2011 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

What do you think would have happened if Hamels had done what Lee did with that grounder?

http://www.thegoodphight.com

by WholeCamels on Sep 3, 2011 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

More “runway antics”. Fucking diva.

by j reed on Sep 3, 2011 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Even more to the point, what if Rollins did it? Or sticking with Pitchers, what if Bastardo did it?

by Cormican on Sep 6, 2011 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

If Bastardo did it, I would probably be too busy getting over the shock that he made fair contact to get too aggravated with his failure to run.

"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."

by dannijd on Sep 13, 2011 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

As for Rollins, I have come to the point of accepting that there are ground balls that he is not going to run out 100% or even 90%- it is conservation of energy and prevention of injury (and quite possibly a smart move in the long run). That being said, I would probably groan, but I would do the same if Pence or Victorino, or any other position player hit a ground ball that they just looked at.

"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."

by dannijd on Sep 13, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

For a guy who talked about being color blind, you’ve got a lot of presumptions in there based on how races work on things.

by Cormican on Sep 3, 2011 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

As for gritty…the truth is that not too many African American cats are mad devoted to playing baseball and doing everything imaginable to make it in the sport.

I rest my case.

Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.

by Justin F. on Sep 4, 2011 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I don’t think I am being personally presumptuous…it is institutionally accepted that the interest that African American kids have in playing baseball is in decline and people are tying to change that. (Though it is fair to suggest the contradiction on the surface.)

As for WholeCamels’ question…the honest answer is I don’t know. When I saw the play, it looked like Lee took a step or two out of the box and saw the picture and just didn’t give the other team the satisfaction of running for no reason. It didn’t seem truly lazy to me, maybe more pragmatic than anything. It seemed kind of creative. But I’m not saying I’m right.

by BySaam on Sep 5, 2011 12:36 AM EDT reply actions  

it is institutionally accepted that the interest that African American kids have in playing baseball is in decline and people are tying to change that.

However, one would assume that anyone in the Majors clearly is pretty interested in playing the sport and would be plenty gritty. What you wrote undermined everything else you posted, backed up Romero’s thoughts and was, frankly, pretty damned racist.

by Cormican on Sep 6, 2011 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

As for gritty…the truth is that not too many African American cats are mad devoted to playing baseball and doing everything imaginable to make it in the sport.

Firstly, people still use the word “cat” to describe a person? Groovy!

Is it a crime to be a person with light skin who works his ass off to compensate for a lack of pure athletic ability to become relevant in a game that he truly loves?

Soooo, white guys need to work harder because they’re not as naturally athletic as those big black boys? Gotcha. White men can’t jump, after all.

Actually, someone of any race needs to work their butt off to make it to the Majors. They would need to be interested in the sport. They would need to be willing to run out grounders and dive to make plays. They would have to “hustle” and “be gritty.” Any athlete of any race. Period. It’s just that white guys often get more credit for doing these things. Why?

If baseball was easy, everyone would do it.

Let's go eat...a triceratops. /velociraptor'd

by LeepinLizardz on Sep 6, 2011 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

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