Playoffs! Phillies 1, Astros 0
by David S. Cohen on Sep 14, 2011 4:46 PM EDT
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PrintFor the fifth time in five years, the Phillies will be in the playoffs. They best their record of four appearances in four years . . . set last year. Folks, these are the glory days of this franchise. It's impossible to understate that. Tell anyone who tries to downplay that fact that they are misanthropes who are better suited for rooting for the late-80s or late-90s version of this franchise. They don't deserve this team.
And they certainly don't deserve Roy Halladay. Today, he took Cliff Lee's Cy Young bid and upped the ante. With the team suffering its first prolonged (three games or more) losing streak in months, Halladay halted that all by himself - shutting out the Astros in a complete game. Unbelievably, this is Halladay's first complete game shutout of the year, despite having 7 previous complete games.
The Phils' only run, the only run of the game, came from the first two batters of the game - a Shane Victorino double followed by a Placido Polanco single. Neither team mustered another run for the rest of the game. With Halladay on the mound, it didn't matter for the Phils.
Fangraph of playoff glory below:
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Woot
Might as well just hand them over.
by All ur Aces R Belong to Us on Sep 14, 2011 4:48 PM EDT reply actions
Magic # is 4?
Follow @PhillyFollower
Writer at Iggles Nest
"It just goes to show that everything you want in life, you get. And you can’t work for it. It just comes to you." - Michael Scott
by PhiladelphiaEagles on Sep 14, 2011 4:49 PM EDT reply actions
For the NL East, yes.
Writer at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
Playoffs???????!!!!!!!!!!
Yes, coach. Playoffs.
Will you marry me, Roy? Thank you from preventing the sweep.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
by doubleh on Sep 14, 2011 4:55 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
This is what 5 Straight playoffs is like. IMO
I wasn't even a year old but I stayed up to be outside the Vet with my Dad and Mom when the Phillies won the World Series 1980.
Someone grab that poor girl a towel.
Might as well just hand them over.
by All ur Aces R Belong to Us on Sep 14, 2011 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Indeed!
Might as well just hand them over.
by All ur Aces R Belong to Us on Sep 14, 2011 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions
PLAYOFFS!!!!!
"Call me dumb, call me stupid, whatever. I block shots."
His Name is Mudd http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo-WjUjzV_Q
@boknows71
This is incredible.
No one knows what it means, but it's provocative! GETS THE PEOPLE GOING!
by Eaglesadvocate on Sep 14, 2011 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions
So my husband tells me of this exchange between LA and Franske:
LA: Do you think Myers has taken a liking to burritos since he moved to Houston?
Franske: ….
LA: I mean, he’s…
Franske: Yea, he’s always been a big guy.
LA: He’s fat!
Franske: ….
LA: I guess maybe his jersey is a little blousy.
Franske: Yea, I would say it’s a bit blousy.
LA: Yea…I mean when he was in Philly, he was a little big, but now he’s just fat.
Franske: (laughing hysterically) I can’t believe you just called Myers fat.
LA: Well, he is!
I don’t care how much of a homer or how crotchety he is, LA just became my second favorite man this week, behind only Doc.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
I know he gets some flak for his announcing style, but I can’t really dislike LA. If for no other reason, he interacts so well with Franske that it’s ridiculous.
i think what makes LA likeable is authenticity. He’s got his flaws, but at least you know you’re getting pure LA. Same deal with a guy like Barkley. The problem is when a guy tries to hard to be a “character” or a specific type. See Kruk, for example. Or just about any former NFL player who has become an analyst.
by TMcAllister on Sep 14, 2011 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions
My favorite exchange between them had to be when LA was talking about bringing his workout clothes on road trips. He said something along the lines of, “Just having them there is helpful to me, even if I don’t actually use them to work out. Just seeing them really gets the dolphins going.”
Franske: "Did you mean endorphins?
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
That’s great.
Might as well just hand them over.
by All ur Aces R Belong to Us on Sep 14, 2011 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Also
RickyBo is at least good for something. One of his good friends umpired last night’s game and he sent him a not too friendly message about last night’s strikezone. That’s one, Ricky.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
Maybe we would get some makeup calls!
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
by dannijd on Sep 14, 2011 6:58 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
It's awesome!
"You play to win the playoffs, and we let 'em off the hook!" -Herm Mora Green
by jrobulls on Sep 14, 2011 5:08 PM EDT reply actions 5 recs
aw yeah
http://www.thegoodphight.com
by WholeCamels on Sep 14, 2011 5:09 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Good thing we aren't playing the Lastros in the playoffs
What is it about that team and Enron (oops, Tropicana) Field?…It’s like the Bermuda Triangle for the Phils, a field where bats and gloves mysteriously disappear.
On the other hand, to clinch a play-off spot with 16 games remaining is very SWEEEEEET. I’m hoping to clinch the division within a few days.
"I have had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it." Groucho Marx
Roy clinches the playoff spot 2 years in a row, and throws a NH in his first ever playoff game. Who should start Game One again?
The good Doctor.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
Definitely ♥
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
by dannijd on Sep 14, 2011 6:09 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Doc is the King.
"Fly Eagles fly..."
by 92-74-99-96 on Sep 14, 2011 6:51 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
SI has a poll out of meanest MLB players.
Chase Utley is #2?!?!?!?!?!
He’s just below AJ Pierzinski!!! Ahead of Zambrano. WTF?
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
I’m so confused as to what “meanest” means and how on earth Utley made a list that has Pierzinski, Zambrano, Bradley, Padilla, etc.
"They say that nobody is perfect. Then they tell you practice makes perfect. I wish they'd make up their minds." - Wilt Chamberlain
I know. They were just discussing on MLB and it’s probably a little too vague in that it may include intimidating in his case (hard nosed, slightly dirty players) and then absolute batshit crazy/assholes like those four you mention above.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
That was what I thought it was (at least as applied to Chase)- the fact is that his play is frequently just on the clean side of dirty- he is going to play the game hard, and there are people who are not going to like that. Most of them have stood between him and the next base.
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
by dannijd on Sep 14, 2011 6:50 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
After Clay Coundrey was sacrificed to Base’bal, it enhanced his reputation as:
A.) a club house leader
B.) A fanatic who will kill you
"I remember being three and I wanted to be a baseball player, that's all I ever really wanted to be. That and Spider Man." -Raul Ibanez
by Jose and the Contrarians on Sep 14, 2011 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Said this in the game thread
but it’s worth repeating.
While some fans may question how Utley made that list, Chase himself is probably pissed he came in second.
Utley: “Piersynzki? Really? More like Pussynzki.”
25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark
by Joecatz on Sep 14, 2011 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
I love what Ozzie said about Piersynzki, “His opponents hate him. His teammates hate him a little less.” That is the huge difference in my mind between Piersynzki and Utley- Utley is only disliked by his opponents.
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
by dannijd on Sep 14, 2011 6:56 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
FWIW, Marcus Hayes was saying anecdotally how lots of other pitchers do not like him because of how he leans in and takes pitches. Again, huge grain of salt.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
The Met’s also got pissy about his hard-slide
by Cole_Hamels_Can on Sep 14, 2011 9:05 PM EDT up reply actions
… keeping in mind that Hayes has had a weird grudge against Utley for about 4 years.
(I know you said grain of salt… I just feel like it’s worth noting).
(and worth noting that that grudge is always set in contrast to his undying love for Howard and Rollins).
by TMcAllister on Sep 14, 2011 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions
I think Hayes feels like he’s “balancing the scales.”
There is a kernel of truth in his diagnosis of the problem. A lot of people love Utley for all the wrong reasons. Utley is a tremendously gifted, productive player – the most gifted and productive player that this team has had over the past 6-8 years, by far – who also happens to have kind of a “scrappy” style. There are far too many Phillies fans, however, who simultaneously (1) think Utley isn’t really all that talented, and (2) nevertheless adore him but only because they think he’s an overachiever and is committed to winning and blah blah blah. Race obviously plays some role in this. It would be naive to assume otherwise.
Meanwhile, with Jimmy, many fans both underappreciate his talent and kinda-sorta dislike him personally. While with Howard, most fans overestimate his talent and are, I guess, neutral on how they feel about him personally (he has big fans and big haters simultaneously).
The way to correct this problem would be for everyone (1) to give Utley credit for being amazingly talented, give Rollins credit for also being very talented though not at the same level as Utley, and give Howard a little less credit for his talent while still recognizing that he’s a decent player, and (2) to like all three guys equally on a personal level.
However, because Hayes is a moron, even though he correctly senses that there’s a problem with the fan base, his attempts to counteract it turn out to be all f*cked up.
Lenin called it “bending the stick.”
The Good Phight, NotGraphs, Twitter, fun!
by FuquaManuel on Sep 14, 2011 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions
TWSS
The Good Phight, NotGraphs, Twitter, fun!
by FuquaManuel on Sep 14, 2011 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Trotsky called it “burying the hatchet.”
by Wet Luzinski on Sep 15, 2011 9:14 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
That’s a great pick.
"I remember being three and I wanted to be a baseball player, that's all I ever really wanted to be. That and Spider Man." -Raul Ibanez
by Jose and the Contrarians on Sep 15, 2011 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions
i thought trotsky called it
burying the icepick
this strikes me as a perfect encapsulation of Hayes’ approach.
by TMcAllister on Sep 15, 2011 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions
While I tend to agree with your basic premise regarding Hayes’ intentions, I’m not sure I’d concur with your assessment of Utley.
While he’s certainly incredibly talented and in NO WAY some overachieving joe, I do think that he plays over the level of his natural physical ability… NOT, as you suggest, by simple hustle and grit, but by being a very smart player.
He’ll never have the crazy raw power of a Howard or Fielder, but he’s become a proficient homerun hitter because of his bat speed, short compact swing™ and patient, selective approach.
He’s not the fastest guy on the team, yet he leads in stolen base percentage mostly due to picking the perfect spots to run – he always seems to catch the other team off guard.
There are any number of examples, but one that always comes to mind for me is a move he’s pulled on many occasions. He’s on 1st when Howard grounds to the first baseman. Utley will run slightly onto the grass directly in the line of sight between the 1st and 2nd basemen, either making the the 1st baseman sidestep to throw, loft it over him slow enough to prevent a double play, or – often times – throw it away at a bad angle. You can tell that every play he makes is one of 3 or 4 possible scenarios he’s run through in his head prior to the outcome of the next pitch.
Jimmy (who’d I’d argue is a little more naturally talented) is another player who has a very good cerebral approach to the game, particularly regarding the defensive aspect of it. The 2009 postseason has a few great examples of this. In the NLDS, when Lee threw a comeback grounder to 2nd in an ill-advised attempt to get the speedy lead runner, Jimmy caught the ball on the ground between the bag and the foot of the sliding runner (was it Fowler?). Knowing it was an unlikely out, Jimmy simply remained in position, hunched over with his glove pinned until the Ump saw that it was clearly an out. Another would be the trapped ball in game 1 of the World Series that was initially ruled a catch, but he was still directing Ryan to tag Matsui for the DP, regardless of what the umpires were currently saying.
While hustle™, grit™ and playing the right way™ are often punch lines around here or buzz words used to mock the WIP crowd, I’d definitely argue that a cerebral approach to the game – or Cholly’s “mental toughness”™ for lack of a better term – is very much a difference maker and can turn good players into great ones.
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Sep 15, 2011 12:41 AM EDT up reply actions
To be fair, while Utley is clearly very talented, probably moreso than anyone else on the team, and we as fans don’t know him personally, it’s not completely off-base to admire the guy’s hustle. It’s well documented that he has a tremendous work ethic, which is probably also the best on the team (though I think you could argue that Carlos Ruiz has to work harder due to the nature of his position). That’s not to say that Jimmy Rollins or anyone else on the team is not a hard worker; that would be silly and wrong. I’m not aware of anyone on the Phillies being reported as lazy in practice, nor do any of them strike me as lazy on the field. However, I’ve heard consistently that Utley’s work ethic is second to none, and I’ve heard this from people who are there watching him or playing with him. That doesn’t mean Utley is a better person or anything, but it’s admirable and isn’t just an assumption people make because of his race.
Best work ethic on the team? This, sir, is an insult to Halladay’s honor. I challenge you to a duel.
by The Gang Wins the Cup on Sep 15, 2011 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, that’s why I think there’s something wrong with the study in general. Everyone has their own interpretation of mean.
For some, just having a strong, forthright personality makes you “mean”.
Man, we are turning into a nation of wimps.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
Ozzie was joking, by the way. The White Sox like Pierzynski. The only place he had the “clubhouse cancer” rep was San Fran.
White Sox Baseball: We're (Still) All Ineffective
Bear down, Chicago Bears!
I ♥ Cliff Lee
I kind of figured that- I just loved that he said that. I am not sure what to think about the rumors of him to Florida- on one hand, the soundbites from Phillies- Marlins games may grow more interesting. On the other, he may bring just enough competence to Miami to make the Marlins a serious contender… nah- money would still be required.
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
Are we still in PANIC mode?
"I remember being three and I wanted to be a baseball player, that's all I ever really wanted to be. That and Spider Man." -Raul Ibanez
by Jose and the Contrarians on Sep 14, 2011 5:37 PM EDT reply actions
HELL YEAH. We only scored FOUR freaking runs this series against one of the worst teams in the last decade. Still, you gotta love our chances
by Boundforbeach on Sep 14, 2011 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions
For you, Professor
Clinching is nice and
Clinching won’t stop you
From resting all the regulars you’d like to.
Ben fresh in right and
Bowker in left field
Throw KK, Orr and mini mart in there too.
So if there’s someone you’d like to try,
If there’s someone you’d like to try
Ask them they won’t say no down in lehigh
Spending long autumn days iindoors
Writing frightening names
On the lineup cards for 18 games
So Charlie, Charlie, Charlie!
Charlie, Charlie, Charlie!
Like, if it’s not John then it’s
The Dom
The Dom
The Dom, The Dom!
The Dom, The Dom, The Dom
Who’ll be best in October.
Playoffs are a crapshoot inevitably
Playoffs are a crapshoot inevitably
So rest me rest me rest me
Because…..
Ca-ca-ca-ca-ca-ca-crapshoot
La la la la la la la la
25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark
by Joecatz on Sep 14, 2011 6:29 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
Of note: Guess who struck out to end last night’s playoff game?
by Wet Luzinski on Sep 15, 2011 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Just some of the stupidity I heard today
-The Phillies season is a failure if they don’t win the WS.
-Cano will win MVP because of his RBI’s
-Shane Victorino is an average player
-Verlander will win the Cy because of his 23 wins
I live in Michigan, so I cannot escape that last one.
It's only gonna get funner
by VanceinmyPants on Sep 14, 2011 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I know what you’re getting at, but we made a pretty big deal of it around here when Doc hit 20 wins last year. I just doesn’t happen all that often. And c’mon, 23 wins is pretty damn impressive. Give Verlander his due.
by Boundforbeach on Sep 14, 2011 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Way I see it, 20+ wins is at the very least, an indication that you’re probably doing something right, where as 10 wins does NOT necessarily mean that you’re doing anything wrong. Beyond that, though, you gotta look deeper into the numbers.
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Sep 14, 2011 7:22 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Wins are a bad stat, but the truth of the matter is bad pitchers rarely get close to 20 wins, Average Pitchers don’t reach it often, and to get there you usually need to be doing your job pretty damned well (you also need to get lucky that everyone on your team also does their job well). I’m no more a fan of wins than anyone else here, and it should be a sole decider in any awards, but Verlander has been pretty awesome this year and 23-25 wins is pretty impressive to me.
Wins do approximate pitcher quality just like many other stats do. They just have an enormous margin of error. King Felix last year pitched well enough to win anywhere between 13 and 25 games. Same with Verlander this year. But neither guy was ever going to win, say, 5 games under any circumstances. Just like Mike Pelfrey would never have won 20 games this year under any circumstances.
I sometimes think that we have Steve Carlton to thank (blame?) for the degree to which wins are fetishized for CYA purposes. If a guy can win 27 games on an atrocious team, surely 13 wins isn’t enough for a CY no matter how bad the team.
Disclaimer: I am not endorsing this viewpoint.
That’s a good point.
I was curious to see just how well Carlton actually pitched that year (would he, in fact, have won 35 games on a good team?). Unfortunately, Fangraphs doesn’t calculate WAR for that far back. On the other hand it does show that Carlton’s FIP- was 60. I have no historical context for that, but it does seem pretty good.
His next best FIP- seasons were 1980 and 1982, at 65 and 66. In both those seasons, he started 38 G and posted a 9.1 WAR. So I’m going to guess that he would have had a little over 10 WAR in 1972, with a 60 FIP- and 41 GS.
By way of comparison, Felix had 6.2 WAR last year in 34 GS. Of course, WAR is a counting stat and it isn’t Felix’s fault that teams use five-man rotations now instead of four-man rotations. Let’s say Carlton would have had a little over 8 WAR if he had pitched in a five-man rotation.
So, Carlton in 1972 was clearly better than Felix was in 2010. But the differential doesn’t seem to explain a difference of 14 wins (or prorated, maybe 11-12 wins). I haven’t looked it up but I’d surmise that the 2010 Mariners’ offense + defense were worse than the 1972 Phillies’ offense + defense. It’s also possible that the 1972 Phillies actually played better in Carlton’s games than they did in other games. I’ve heard a lot of anecdotal evidence to support that, and I guess it’s possible, although if it was actually the case, I’d assume that it was just because of random variance, not because of the whole mythology that Carlton actually made the team better by giving them more confidence or what not.
I don’t know where to find pitcher run support numbers, but I did recently read that the Phillies scored a bit more for Carlton in ‘72 than they did on average. But not 11-12 wins’ worth.
baseball-ref has them on the game log pages. Carlton had 3.83 runs per 27 outs, which was considerably better than most of the other Phillies pitchers (Ken Reynolds 3.0, Bill Champion 2.9, Dick Selma 2.4, Wayne Twitchell 2.1—Woodie Fryman was the exception at 3.9).
by perfectdepth on Sep 15, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
overall, the 1972 Phillies scored 3.22 R/G, second worst in the league. 3.8 R/G would’ve still been slightly below average (3.91 R/G).
by perfectdepth on Sep 15, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
baseball-ref WAR puts Carlton at 12.2, which is the second-best season post-1900, behind only 1913 Walter Johnson’s 12.4.
top pitcher WAR 1900-present
1. 1913 Walter Johnson, 12.4
2. 1972 Steve Carlton, 12.2
3. 1968 Bob Gibson, 11.9
4. 1912 Walter Johnson, 11.8
5. 1985 Dwight Gooden, 11.7
by perfectdepth on Sep 15, 2011 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I like that list. Of course, I’m biased so take that with a grain of salt. And by the way, the American League really should honor Walter Johnson in some way with a pitching award, like if you win the pitcher’s Triple Crown you get a Walter Johnson.
by phillyinportland on Sep 15, 2011 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions
1. Failure is too strong a word. Disappointment, however, is not.
2. Unfortunately, many voters think this way.
3. What is this I don’t even
4. See #2 (he deserves it, but for more reasons than the overrated “wins” stat)
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Sep 14, 2011 6:38 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He does deserve the Cy, but because of his wins? Come on
by phillies0100 on Sep 14, 2011 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions
spike in the Fangraph for the Paredes single...
Did they forget who was pitching?
4/6 and counting...
by DirtyWaters on Sep 14, 2011 8:04 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
Did Halladay pitch in last year’s debacle? I think he must have, since I know Oswalt didn’t pitch in that series and it was a four-gamer.
I was there… the grounds crew must have forgotten that they were supposed to move the walls between halves of the innings because Halladay gave up three home runs en route to losing 4-3.
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
by dannijd on Sep 14, 2011 8:48 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I was at that game too. Section 120. My memory of that whole series needs to encounter an event horizon, somehow.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Except for the part where Oswalt played left field.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
Which almost made the rest of that awful series worth it.
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
by dannijd on Sep 14, 2011 9:24 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, but the circumstances leading to Oswalt playing left were less than desirable.
Do you see what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps?
so did he thank Howard after the game for making him poop his pants?
4/6 and counting...
by DirtyWaters on Sep 14, 2011 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I messed up: it was 2 home runs (Pence and Bourn) in a 3-2 loss.
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
by dannijd on Sep 14, 2011 9:23 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Pence hit one of those homers for Houston. Also, there was a creepy large amount of birds hovering the stadium that day too. Like, easily a thousands birds.
We got the 4 aces for baseball, 3CBO in football, and the Russian Walls in hockey. Philly is no longer the blue collar losers, were primetime baby!
Good game, Lets eat
For those interested, in the past decade, there have been 20 CY young winners. The person who won the most games in his respective league actually won the award 9 times. In 7 of those instances that person was a 20 game winner.
There were 5 instances where there was one 20 game winner in the league and that person did not win.
20 wins is not automatic, it’s a myth.
25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark
It may not be automatic, but it’s a rather large “bonus.” Imagine two players with near-identical ERA, K/BB, IP, CG, FIP, everything. One plays for a good team, such as the Phils, and puts together a 21-10 record. The other plays for the Mets, and finished 12-15.
In that scenario, one of those guys is a lock.
Remaining schedules for potential playoff teams:
Milwaukee:
3 at CIN
3 at CHC
3 vs. FLA
3 vs. PIT
Arizona:
3 at SD
3 vs. PIT
3 vs. SF
3 vs. LAD
St. Louis:
4 at PHI
3 vs. NYM
3 vs. CHC
3 at HOU
Atlanta:
3 vs. NYM
3 at FLA
3 at WAS
3 vs. PHI
Any bets on what the first round matchup will be? Right now Arizona and Milwaukee are tied at 87-62, while Atlanta leads the wild card at 86-64 and St. Louis is back at 81-68. Seems to me that Milwaukee has a bit of an easier schedule left than Arizona, and obviously Philly and Atlanta can’t meet in the first round. Plus the Brewers are probably the better team compared to Arizona. I think the first round matchups will be ARI at PHI and ATL at MIL, but there’s still some drama left!
Those, of course, do not include the results of tonight’s games, which are in progress (Arizona hasn’t started yet).
by Baseball Nerd on Sep 14, 2011 9:03 PM EDT up reply actions
I like the Cards’ chances on the face of things, to win more than the Braves in the last 4 series. That said, they really need the Barves to keep tanking to have a real shot. I’d love a Phillies sweep that last series giving the WC to the Cards. I’m petty.
One of the announcers on the Houston crew today mentioned that Doc might be in the HOF discussion soon if he gets some more wins… yes… because wins are a real measure of pitching. Did anyone else find it funny that Wakefield’s final win came in a game where he gave of 5 ER’s over 6 innings… perfect example of the meaninglessness of wins.
by Cole_Hamels_Can on Sep 14, 2011 9:10 PM EDT reply actions
I can’t stand career totals arguments for the HOF in general. I think it puts longevity above greatness. Instead of looking at how many wins or home runs or whatever stat they use as a measuring stick for their entire career, I would prefer that they take a segment, say 12 years of each player’s career instead. The player would have to be the best if not one of the best at his position for that entire time period and statistically match up favorably during that stretch to current HOFers at the position as well.
4/6 and counting...
best argument for that
are roy’s years with 150+ ERA+. Everyone with at least 6 such seasons is in.
The Saberhagan argument is gone now, because he’s a full season passed Saberhagen. David Cone has also been left in the dust.
However, the big argument is Kevin Brown 64 WAR and didn’t even sniff the ballot. I don’t like the odds of that with Roy behind all the best 90’s pitchers.
It’s just good to hear Doc is finally almost in the discussion.
(is this where I do this: /s ?)
by TMcAllister on Sep 14, 2011 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah I was also pissed about that… but it’s sad that he might actually not end up in the HOF due to a lack of a ring… I would hope that doesn’t happen.
by Cole_Hamels_Can on Sep 14, 2011 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed. The ring must come. This year. It’s GO TIME!
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
Fixed.
Agreed. The ring rings must come. This year, next year, the year after and in 2014. It’s GO TIME!
Well, I was trying not to be too greedy. :-)
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
The winningest 1st ballot HOF'er of all time:
If he weren’t, you know… a somewhat racist comic book villain.
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Sep 15, 2011 12:47 AM EDT up reply actions
I was thinking of posting an image of Coal-Black
As an example of a REALLY racist character… but then I remembers this wasn’t talking chop.
by Cole_Hamels_Can on Sep 15, 2011 1:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Halladay Hall of Fame chances.
Careerwise, WAR has him as the 40th best pitcher ever in MLB.
Guys ahead of him still who aren’t in.
1. Roger Clemens
2. Greg Maddux
3. Pedro Martinez
4. Mike Mussina
5. Curt Schilling
6. Tom Glavine
7. Rick Reuschel
8. Tony Mullane
9. Kevin Brown
10. Jim McCormick
11. John Smoltz.
Everybody above Reuschel is in. Reuschel has 66.3 WAR. Halladay has 61.
Of the 23 guys between him and Koufax, 14 are in the hall of fame. His hall of fame chances have to be around 75 percent already.
So how does he stack up to Reuschel, who’s the best pitcher not on the ballot?
Reuschel:
Wins – 214
Win pct – .528
IP – 3548
ERA+ 114
SO 2015
WHIP 1.275
SO/9 5.1
SO/BB 2.16
CG – 65
SHO – 17
Taking his best 5 seasons:
ERA+ 159, 158, 149, 131, 131, 130,
So it’s pretty clear that Roy has a much higher peak than Reuschel, the big difference is IPs and wins.
Of those with 2500 IPs, Roy is superior to all of them, Koufax included.
What I’d like to see from Roy to get into the HOF.
1, Pass Reuschel in WAR. Can be done with another good season under his belt.
IPx ERA+ gives Reuschel 4044 effective innings. Roy has 3425 effective innings. Jack Morris has 4014 effective innings.
Clemens has the PEDs issue, and Maddux and Pedro aren’t eligible until 2013 and 2014 respectively. Not sure about the rest.
Just an FYI.
by Airedale260 on Sep 15, 2011 12:40 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Here I thought
it was the hall of stats! Shame on me. :p
Yes, by ‘fame’ measures, Roy’s doing well.
Needs another 20 wins, 10 over .500, A .682 win percentage, and another 500 IPs, to reach the average Hall of Fame career standards.
His Grey ink test will get 4+4+4+3+3+2+2+1+1+1. He got every category this year, which will put him well over the hall average.
So really, the only thing we are waiting for, is another 500 IPs and he can book his ticket to cooperston, with 250 solid IPs.
Does anyone want to see St.Louis get into the playoffs over Atlanta?
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
I hate the Braves. However, the less time I waste watching Tony LaRussa, the better. I’m conflicted.
Let's go eat...a triceratops. /velociraptor'd
by LeepinLizardz on Sep 15, 2011 9:11 AM EDT up reply actions
I am trying to figure out what would be more soul crushing to Braves fans, missing the playoffs all together or potentially facing the Phillies and getting blasted out of the playoffs by them. Whichever is worse for them, that’s the one I want. I’m out for blood at this point.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Probably losing out on the playoffs altogether after being a really good team this year, then watching the Cardinals upset the Phillies and win the WS with “their spot.”
A very close second would probably be a Phillies WS win, so let’s just settle on that.
by Wet Luzinski on Sep 15, 2011 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Especially since we play them them last series of the season. That would be more crushing than losing in the post season. They’re supposed to lose in the postseason. They’re not supposed to miss.
25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark
That would be amazing actually. If we could prevent them from making the playoffs by owning them in the last series of the year. But I would imagine, or at least hope that Charlie is fielding a replacement level team at that point. Not that it really helped the Brewers.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
This almost happened last year under nearly identical circumstances. Phils won the first two games in Atlanta fielding a lot of reserves. Worley (who was just a September call-up at the time, remember) pitched the second game and won it. It wasn’t until Charlie went really hardcore replacement level in the third game that the Braves finally won.
and really it was him using the game as a pitching tune-up that did it: Hamels, Oswalt, and Blanton all pitched, but it was Baez who shat the bed…. final was 8-7
Phillies keep the Braves out of the playoffs by sweeping them in the last series of the year, despite the fact that the good guys are resting starters.
Then Larry Jones announces that he will not be retiring for 5-7 more years no matter how decrepit he becomes.
by The Gang Wins the Cup on Sep 15, 2011 9:53 AM EDT up reply actions
If letting the Braves get into the playoffs is what’s necessary to persuade Chipper to stick around another year, then I’m all for it.
Or stated another way, we need to think about what’s worse for the Braves in the long run, and not just for this season. Build for the future!
speaking of which, this is a non-terrible TC piece about the Braves in light of Moneyball:
http://www.talkingchop.com/2011/9/15/2424055/how-moneyball-has-influenced-the-braves-organization
Potential Suitors for Jose Reyes
Does anyone actually think Ruben would go after Reyes? Because I think he might and that scares me, a lot.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
I think he’d have to trade someone like Shane or Chase to be able to make that happen
4/5 and counting...
by DirtyWaters on Sep 15, 2011 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Possibly. They do have a crap ton of money coming off the books this off season and possibly more if Oswalt retires or they don’t pick up his option. But they also have guys getting big raises as well.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Howard’s contract goes up by 5 mil plus resigning Cole and Closer/Bullpen help will take away a good chunk of that and they aren’t paying Oswalt a lot of money this season…Astros picked up most of his remaining contract
4/5 and counting...
by DirtyWaters on Sep 15, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
I think the Astros’ only picked up money on Oswalt’s contract for last year.
As for bullpen, I would not be shocked if they filled most of their void there with in house candidates. Bastardo, Stutues, Herndon, Kendrick, Bear Jew and someone else in the minors.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
they picked up 11 million of the 23.46 remaining which includes the 2 million buyout. There was 5.46 million left on his contract in 2010 at the time of the trade and the Astros picked up 4 million of that leaving 7 million to go to this season’s total. The Phils are paying Oswalt 9 million this season.
4/5 and counting...
by DirtyWaters on Sep 15, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
I sure hope so. One of my greatest fears for this offseason is that Ruben will waste money on the pen because he thinks it needs more “seasoning”.
The only place in which I hope Ruben spends any real money on the pen is only to bring back Madson, and only for the right price. To wit, I do not think the right price really exists with what Madson deserves and probably expects.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
Same here. To me a pen of:
DeFratus/Aumont
Bear Jew
Chunk/Savery (AKA the weirdest prospect development season I can ever recall seeing)
Mathieson (long man/6th starter)
Stutes
Herndon
Bastardo
Looks pretty good. I’d also like to see Kendrick go away, but I think that’s unlikely
I think, unfortunately, that the FO have already made up their minds on Mathieson and Zagurski. They will never get a fair chance here. If Madson, Contreras, and Kendrick are all gone, the Phillies will be signing free agents to seven-figure deals, bank on it.
I think it would be preferable to just go with Aumont, De Fratus, and Savery to fill the three open spots, but (1) I can’t see the FO doing that either, and (2) even though it would be better than signing free agents, it would still be far from ideal. Maybe those three guys will all be ready by April 1, but I think it’s unlikely that all three will be ready, and relying on them all to be ready with no backup plan will put a lot of pressure on both them and the team.
Ideally, Madson will be back at a fair price and Contreras will be healthy. Other scenarios may work out, but they are all necessarily second-best scenarios.
I forgot about Contreras’ remaining year.
I’m not 100% that they’ve given up on Mathieson since he’s still on the 40 man. Had they truly given up, I think they would have DFA’d him during one of the roster squeezes earlier this season. I actually think they moved him to the LV rotation in the hopes he can be the 6th man next year, maybe more.
You’re probably right about Chunk, but as a Lefty, I think he may still be in the mix next year. Especially since Savery only has a little over a month of success under his belt.
Zagurski’s on the 40 man too, isn’t he? I don’t think either guy’s survival means the Phils intend to give them more opportunities. They were just ahead of other guys who were even lower on that totem pole. But I hope I’m wrong.
I think Zagurski may actually have a reverse split, so his leftyness won’t necessarily help his cause. Then again, the FO might not have noticed that.
what i'm hoping for in 2012 (bullpen)
Closer: Madson signed to reasonable extension
8th inning: Bastardo
7th inning: Contreras healthy again
Right handed middle relief: Herndon, Schwimer, Stutes
Long reliever/spot starter: Moyer making triumphant return at age 49
Left out: Kendrick
Opportunity with another organization: Mathieson, Zagurski
AAA: Aumont, De Fratus, Savery
I’m not really high on Contreras at this point. I’d be more inclined to let Herndon and Stutes fight for that 7th inning, and use the other slot for maybe a LOOGY. Well, except that Manuel doesn’t properly use LOOGY’s, so maybe they just find some cheap, unheralded guy from the scrap heap and throw him into the mix.
This is what I’m hoping for, not necessarily what I’m expecting. Contreras is already under contract for next year, so any hoped-for outcome has to include him being healthy and pitching well.
Or in other words, not being “high” on Contreras isn’t relevant to the point I was making. There are only four possible alternatives. One is that he’s on the team and healthy, rebounds, and pitches well. Two is that he’s on the team but doesn’t rebound and pitches not so well. Three is that he’s not healthy. Four is that he’s healthy but pitches so badly that the team feels compelled to cut him, thus opening up a spot for a younger pitcher. Of those choices, Option One is obviously far superior to any of the other three.
Forgot he was under contract. In that case, I just hope he’s at least somewhat healthy and doesn’t suck when he does pitch. The good news is that if you have Madson and Bastardo back, you don’t have to worry too much about depending on him for the 7th inning; you have other guys who are potentially good enough for that.
— 
See I’m not so sure. Ruben just has this thing about him where it’s like he has to land the biggest fish. That is what scares me about him.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
I should clarify that. I do agree that Rollins is the better fit. Just not that Ruben may base his decision off that.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
I almost think the better question is does anyone think Reuben WON’T go after Reyes?
25.8/106 "Winter is coming" -Eddard Stark
I don’t think he will, but I’m very uneasy about it. I do think Ruben loves the shock value of being “bold”, and may start to do things in the future that are just bold for the sake of boldness.
it’s possible he may be under more constraints, with the luxury tax threshold approaching
but, anyway, I’m more wary of the idea that the Phillies will think Galvis is the way to go
Yeah, that worries me too. For some reason, I’m getting a standoffish vibe from the FO on Jimmy that’s similar to the one I felt about Burrell around this time in 2008.
Rollins is more important today than Burrell ever was.
Ed Snider is a crotchety old fuck.
That is all.
If they can meaningfully upgrade 3B somehow (David Wright?), I’m OK with parting ways with Rollins and going with Galvis.
Of course, Wright would be very expensive in more ways than one.
I think RAJ will make an offer to what he thinks is fair(by fair, i mean keeps them under the luxury tax). I also could possibly see Polonco not coming back. Small chance but I can see it.
We got the 4 aces for baseball, 3CBO in football, and the Russian Walls in hockey. Philly is no longer the blue collar losers, were primetime baby!
Good game, Lets eat
Polanco will be back
The organization owes him 6.5 million on the third year of his contract next year. Considering his recent injury history, not many teams will be interested in paying that, and if the Phillies have to pick up a substantial amount, it is really not worth it to them.
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
Proposed Phillies Mural
What do we think of it? Click here.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
its…..nice
We got the 4 aces for baseball, 3CBO in football, and the Russian Walls in hockey. Philly is no longer the blue collar losers, were primetime baby!
Good game, Lets eat
IDK. I’m torn. It’s reallllllly busy and sort of reminds me of a cheap baseball card. You can vote on the last player to be added to it; details forthcoming. Already featured are: Brad Lidge, Charlie Manuel, Mitch Williams, Cole Hamels, Grover Cleveland Alexander, Larry Bowa, Darren Daulton, Dallas Green, Tug McGraw, Ed Delahanty, Mike Schmidt, Ryan Howard, Chuck Klein, Tony Taylor, Dick Allen, Shibe Park, Jim Bunning, Veterans Stadium, Roy Halladay, Citizens Bank Park, Robin Roberts, Harry Kalas, Richie Ashburn, Steve Carlton, Jimmy Rollins, Chase Utley, and the Phillie Phanatic.
Lidge? Other than the iconic imagine, I don’t know that I would have featured him…or Williams for that matter.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
I don’t know for whom to vote. Everyone’s on the thing. Chooch?
I’d vote for Rolen just to piss people off.
What kind of plane is it? Oh, it's a big pretty white plane with red stripes, curtains in the windows and wheels and it looks like a big ol' Tylenol.
J.D. Drew
We got the 4 aces for baseball, 3CBO in football, and the Russian Walls in hockey. Philly is no longer the blue collar losers, were primetime baby!
Good game, Lets eat
ha… what would be the all fan unfavorite, or conflicted, team? possibly not enough for a whole lineup
Well, Mike Schmidt is already on there, as is Dick Allen. Otherwise, you’ve got Von Hayes, Mike Lieberthal, Abreu (all undeserving, btw), Travis Lee, Chris Wheeler, Baker Bowl, and the Red Phanatic.
The Bull
I was wondering if anybody else noticed he wasn’t on there. Putting Pete Rose on would probably get the team banned from baseball.
by phillyinportland on Sep 16, 2011 4:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Abreu’s gotta be the most deserving player not on there, though, right? if not him, then who—Schilling? Sliding Billy Hamilton? after those three the quality drops off a lot, unless I’m missing someone…Garry Maddox? Del Ennis? Juan Samuel? Puddin’ Head Willie Jones?
by perfectdepth on Sep 15, 2011 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions
ah, I did miss someone. I think Abreu’s better (arguably Schilling too), but I realize that’s, shall we say, an unpopular opinion in Philadelphia.
by perfectdepth on Sep 16, 2011 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions
Pretty cheesy. But that’s ok, I suppose.
I’m having trouble figuring out which building this is supposed to be. I’m guessing it’s the one that says “WALNUT BRIDGE 751-2727” on it? Link. That doesn’t look like it’s eight stories though.
Now this is a mural....
.
Besides, some of the best mural painters today are graffitti artists. It would be awesome if it was completely interactive – every few months, a new grafitti artist or a few would be given the wall. The current mural, compositional speaking, has a very iconographic feel to it much like the work of the Renaissance done for churches.
.
.
Top row
Andrea del Sarto, Assumption of the Virgin. 1530, oil on wood. Raphael, The Madonna of Folingo. 1511-12, oil on canvas [320×194 cm]. The Transfiguration. 1517, oil on panel [405cm x 278 cm]. Titian, The Assumption of the Virgin. 1516-17, oil on wood.
Bottom row
El Greco, Adoration of the Shepherds, 1612-14, oil on canvas [ 319cm x 180 cm]. The Resurrection. 1596-1600, oil on canvas [127cm x 275 cm]. The Annunciation. 1597-1600, oil on canvas [115cm x 67 cm]. Baptism of Christ. 1608-14, oil on canvas [330cm x 211 cm].
Wow
They have nothing to do with baseball but those are impressive works of art.
by phillyinportland on Sep 16, 2011 5:00 AM EDT up reply actions
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