Some Phillies Links For You, January 3, 2012: Icy Hot, Heroic Doc, Reading Mystery
by WholeCamels on Jan 3, 2012 7:54 AM EST
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PrintWinter Classic 2012: Rangers 3, Flyers 2 - Broad Street Hockey
So there was sport at Citizens Bank Park yesterday, only it was ice hockey instead of baseball. Go read all about it at Broad Street Hockey, SB Nation's Philadelphia Flyers blog.
NHL.com - Victorino a very interested observer - 2012 Bridgestone NHL Winter Classic Blog
Victorino said he has tried skating once before, at a rink in Oahu -- the only one in Hawaii. "I tried it as a kid, but wasn't very successful," he said. "I tried to run, not push off. That sport didn't last long for Shane."
Yup!
Phillies Resolutions: Roy Halladay
Keep being awesome.
Three former Jays, including Roy Halladay, rescue snake bite victim
Just because this needs more coverage.
Baseball whispers: Kyle Drabek bait for Matt Garza - Chicago Tribune
Poor kid...
Philly's Search for an Out Pro Athlete - The Advocate
I think anyone with even a little sense knows that there's almost certainly a gay "big four sports" athlete in this town. But attitudes and stereotypes can take a long time to go away.
Reading Phillies Invite Fans to Partake in Weird Mystery Thing - That Balls Outta Here
"What has six legs, four arms, three heads, and sounds like this?" -- I dunno but I'm guessing it's the next package of prospects heading out of town this July.
Phillies Phlashback No. 1: Wilson Gets the Win
That game was fun, but wow was I tired at work the next day.
Angels considering Ryan Madson?
Will set-up for food.
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“What has six legs, four arms, three heads, and sounds like this?” — I dunno but I’m guessing it’s the next package of prospects heading out of town this July.
If we manage to trade somebody a prospect with no arms, I think we can reasonably make the claim that we finally fleeced somebody.
Moyer for 5th Starter in 2012.
by Missing Jamie Moyer on Jan 3, 2012 9:30 AM EST reply actions
Unless...
Two of the players are Jim Abbott clones
Unless...
Two of the players are Jim Abbott clones.
Fail
Win an elimination game where his team scores 0 runs.
by Nikk.m on Jan 3, 2012 10:29 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
:(
I fear if we don’t put Pence and Hamels into long term contracts and have some new bat emergence (Brown) this might be the last strong year this team has (maybe the following) with how strong the NL East is getting.
?? – David Hale wrote this on December 30, which would put the date at February 8th — it can’t really be that early, right?
So, as the Phillies turn the calendar to a new year – and the report date for pitchers and catchers is just a mere 40 days away – we look at some of the biggest concerns Amaro and the Phillies still face.
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Celebrating over 50 years of slightly more Phils wins than losses: 1961-2011
Former Phillies draft pick Ryan Garvey has dropped out of USC because he didn’t like having to study.
Proposed: Baseball players are the dumbest athletes on Earth. Discuss.
After one semester at USC, Ryan Garvey says there was way too much studying getting in the way of his professional baseball dreams. So he’s off to Riverside Community College for a short stint before entering this summer’s draft
so what does that say about Riverside CC?
Be sure to drink your ovaltine
Well, basketball and football players generally have gone to college. Even if they get athlete grades, they still go, which means they absorb something. A large number of baseball players don’t, so I’ve always agreed with your basic point. Though, hockey players are probably pretty similar, right?
by David S. Cohen on Jan 3, 2012 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, but I find a decent amount of them to be well spoken and intelligent, perhaps because they aren’t American and their school systems are better?
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
I don’t even necessarily think a large amount of the goons were that stupid; some of them became goons just to be able to keep a spot on a roster out of desperation. Going to college often hurts player development in the NHL, too. The Flyers wanted JVR out of college ASAP. You develop in Juniors or the AHL. Most college programs are not considered to be very good.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
I believe it was uber-goon Stu Grimson who became a successful lawyer after his career was over.
I guess I can see how hockey players might be oranges among apples here, since they’re mostly from different countries. Although I don’t know enough to really say.
I’m sure there are plenty of dumb hockey players—Daniel Carcillo is one that immediately comes to mind—to balance out the smart ones. I’ve just often found the phrase “dumb jock” to be overused and often incorrect. There’s so many dumb people everywhere.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
Ha, can’t argue with that.
It makes me happy that none of the Phillies strike me as being 100% stone stupid. I’ve made a lot of fun of Victorino along these lines over the years (and rightfully so, kind of), but even he has the odd savant-like moment from time to time. Pence too. And the others seem like they’re at least average-ish. The least articulate speaker of the group might actually be Halladay.
But Roy quotes Shakespeare! (sort of)
My money’s on Lee, who admits he doesn’t read.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
You know, I’m glad you reminded me of that. Even though that Shakespeare quote wasn’t for real-for real, I thought that press conference as a whole was very impressive and it affected my opinion of Roy’s speaking ability for the better. And then I forgot about it.
“The least articulate speaker of the group might actually be Halladay.”
This is interesting. I’ve always found Halladay’s interviews to be fairly interesting and well thought out. He makes the occasional grammatical blunder (“funner”), but I’ve never gotten the impression he was either unintelligent or inarticulate.
I think he’s likely just somewhat introverted and not as comfortable with public speaking, thus the occasional mis-speak.
He’s certainly no Pedro Martinez in this regard.
Editor at SB Nation's Philadelphia Union blog, The Brotherly Game. Follow me on Twitter.
I still think he said “funner” on purpose, like to be funny.
Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.
by TheOrangeCone on Jan 3, 2012 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
At the very least, they all come across as pretty nice dudes who really enjoy playing the game with each other. I’m not saying the personality of the players should matter, but it makes me happier to root for a bunch of nice guys.
Since Shane has gotten a Twitter, my love for him has multiplied by a thousand.
Goons can be very intelligent (hell Parros has a degree from Princeton, Tanner Glass went to Dartmouth), but when your career centers around getting punched in the face, you may not stay particularly intelligent for very long.
Just for the hell of it, I looked for current Ivy Leaguers in the major sports
Baseball (5):
Ryan Lavarnway (Yale)
Chris Young (Princeton)
Russ Ohlendorf (Princeton)
Will Venable (Princeton)
Mark DeRosa (U Penn)
Football (8):
Colin Cloherty (Brown)
Zak DeOssie (Brown)
Kevin Boothe (Cornell)
Bryan Walters (Cornell)
Matt Birk (Harvard)
Desmond Bryant (Harvard)
Ryan Fitzpatrick (Harvard)
James Williams (Harvard)
Basketball (0):
No current Ivy League players in the NBA
Hockey (25):
Harry Zolnierczyk (Brown)
Matt Greening (Cornell)
Matt Moulson (Cornell)
Douglas Murray (Cornell)
Brendon Nash (Cornell)
Riley Nash (Cornell)
Ryan O’Byrne (Cornell)
Ben Scrivens (Cornell)
T. J. Galiardi (Dartmouth)
Tanner Glass (Dartmouth)
Nick Johnson (Dartmouth)
David Jones (Dartmouth)
Lee Stempniak (Dartmouth)
J. T. Wyman (Dartmouth)
Craig Adams (Harvard)
Louis Leblanc (Harvard)
Dominic Moore (Harvard)
Dylan Reese (Harvard)
Taylor Fedun (Princeton)
Jeff Halpern (Princeton)
George Parros (Princeton)
Darroll Powe (Princeton)
Kevin Westgarth (Princeton)
Christopher Higgins (Yale)
Brad Mills (Yale)
Bob.
No current ivy league players in the NBA worked so much better on so many different levels.
And I’m assuming that Most of the hockey players were recruited to play hockey in the ivy leagues?
"Sometimes, the balls that fall in are jam shots"...Hunter Pence, on BABIP
I would assume so. You have to be at least 18 to be drafted in the NHL, so most of them would have been recruited and offered scholarships by the time the draft came around. Leblanc is the weird one, though. He started in the Canadian juniors system, moved to Nebraska and played in the USHL, was drafted by Montreal, then played for Harvard for one year, then went back to the Canadian juniors.
Bob.
No scholarships in the Ivy League. Although they do get financial aid and what not.
Also, some of those guys don’t need scholarships. Hockey’s kind of funny in that you have a majority of players who grew up middle- or lower-class in Canada or Russia or wherever, learning the game on the ponds behind their barns. And then you have a handful of rich prep school kids who learned the game at Exeter. Like Jeremy Roenick, although I don’t think he went to college, probably because he was just too good.
No small task to play Ivy League though. I used to play LaCrosse against the Princeton and U Penn club teams all the time. They always had a few players whose GPAs dipped into the 3.5 range which made them ineligible for the D1 team by school/team/league rules (not sure which, as different players explained it differently to me). As they explained to me, there are no athlete grades in the Ivy, you have to do just as well as the non-athletes, or you can transfer.
My first car was a 1988 Buick Regal. White with red plush interior. What a piece of shit.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
/fixed
My first car was a
Buick Regal, white and red.
What a piece of shit.
by topherstarr on Jan 5, 2012 9:15 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Ha, I had an ’86 Buick Century, also red plush interior.
Next I had a giant Thunderbird, 1987-ish. Nice sound system, even if it was cassette only.
http://www.thegoodphight.com
How about this car when I was an early teen: my Dad had a 1981 Cadillac Eldorado, bronze, with white leather interior. Diesel (!) with an 8-track player.
Fricking pimp car.
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
Wow. How often did the records skip?
"I wouldn’t run if there was a fire. I wouldn’t run anywhere. I hate running." - O. Munn
Short of installing a player piano, that’s officially the weirdest add on to a sound system you could really have in a car.
I’d have to imagine it skipped frequently, and what a pain to have to flip, and put down the needle half way through the album.
We always thought it was a factory part of the car. I guess I really have no idea, but it was an enormous car.
It sounds like something you’d find in Austin Powers’ car, or possibly Wilt Chamberlain’s.
http://mcarch.wordpress.com/2010/01/31/wilt-the-stilt-and-his-house-on-the-hill/
They always had a few players whose GPAs dipped into the 3.5 range which made them ineligible for the D1 team by school/team/league rules (not sure which, as different players explained it differently to me).
Either school or team. Assuming a 2.0 is considered the lowest GPA for graduation, freshmen are required to have a 1.8, sophomores a 1.9, and juniors a 2.0 at the end of the year to maintain eligibility. For a 3.5 to make them ineligible, that would have to be the minimum graduating GPA, and the player in question would need to be an upperclassman.
Bob.
Also possible it was related to # of classes. We typically played the Ivy’s in fall tournaments. With lacrosse being a spring sport, they may have carried too few credits to be academically eligible in the immediate following semester, when D1 teams typically play a few tournaments to incorporate Freshmen, work on sets and clears, and give reserves extra playing time.
That’s possible. The requirement for classes is a minimum of 6 hours per semester, with a minimum of 24 per year, with summer classes eligible, and 18 per previous two semesters, not including summer (so, basically, a maximum of 6 hours per summer). There are a couple other rules about cumulative hours and such, but following the 24 per year and 18 per two consecutive fall/spring/fall semesters would keep a student eligible.
Bob.
Well, recruited and Scholarships are not necessarily one and the same.
I would assume a stud hockey player has that much more chance of getting into harvard than an average kid.
"Sometimes, the balls that fall in are jam shots"...Hunter Pence, on BABIP
Geography?
Wow that’s wild. Maybe it has to do with the Ivy League schools being in Northern climes.
Nothing has come easy, but I guess that wouldn't be the Philadelphia way if it did come easy. - Jimmy Rollins
Need some help..."The Art of Fielding"...anyone read it?
The reader reviews on Chad Harbach’s highly acclaimed novel are polarizing to say the least, see Amazon, and that only enhances my already peaked curiosity on a fictional literary work that intertwines baseball and life, and lands on the NY times 2011 top ten list with a glowing review that starts as follows:
To defenders of baseball and literary fiction, the charges against each are familiar, and overlapping: too slow, too precious, not enough action. The only realistic response is a resigned shrug. Guilty, and so what? You may as well complain that lemons are too yellow. The indictment amounts to a kind of category error; detractors went looking for entertainment, and found art instead.I probably will end up reading this book, but I wanted to check in with TGPer’s to see if I could find a more relatably trustworthy opinion.
Be sure to drink your ovaltine
I remember that the critic from NPR put this on her top ten list too, with a snide remark about she was amazed that a book could make interesting the dullest game ever invented, or words to that effect. Haven’t seen anything from Fangraphs or what not, though I’m not sure if I’d trust their opinions either. Maybe we should do a TGP book club.
I haven’t read it, but just fyi it’s “piqued” curiosity.
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Celebrating over 50 years of slightly more Phils wins than losses: 1961-2011
Do we have enough long-term data to project his curiosity forward for next season? Otherwise, it’s too early to call it a peak.
by Phrozen on Jan 3, 2012 8:21 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The curiosity is getting old and stale. The window is closing. The time to find out is NOW!
Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.
by TheOrangeCone on Jan 3, 2012 9:27 PM EST up reply actions
"If we get an indication that Jose isn’t going to be ready, we might look to see if there’s some low-hanging fruit out there," Amaro said. "But every indication we’ve gotten so far on Contreras is that he’s going to be fine and we’ll go with the kids and let them compete for jobs."
Sez Salisbury. I think that’s good. Hopefully it isn’t BS.
I really wouldn’t be opposed to bringing Lidge back if he came on a contract like the one Dontrelle signed. at this point, the Phillies may even be able to bring Madson back and a similar salary that he had last year.
I’d rather go with the young guys regardless of the size of a potential Lidge contract. If they succeed, it benefits the organization to know they can do it. If they fail, you don’t really lose anything.
Why?
Take the money you won’t spend on Lidge, subtract 475k for a rookies salary and use what’s left to pay Hamels, or save it for cap at the deadline for a readily available reliever or better yet, a piece you’ll need then that can’t be defined now.
"Sometimes, the balls that fall in are jam shots"...Hunter Pence, on BABIP
A good bullpen can be difficult to construct for a low cost (which most bullpens are). I like using the young guys, but if the Phillies could bring somebody like Lidge back at a very low cost (not much risk) or bringing back an established guy like Madson for a very reasonable cost, I’m not against it. I’m not exactly frightened by the Phillies pen going into 2012, but I would have no objections with going to veterans for a cheap cost.
A bullpen is difficult to construct at any cost. Your best bet is to cast a wide net and break spring training with the hot hands. This means, lots of rookies, NRIs, Minor league free agents, etc. If your bullpen is a weakness, maybe you can trade some spare parts for a hot hand in-season. Signing Lidge carries the risk that you’re tying up cash that could be used for that in-season trade for the hot hand.
Exactly. Or to put it another way, when you respond to counterarguments, Mattypmp, you have to respond to counterarguments. You don’t just restate your original argument at greater length.
by taco pal on Jan 4, 2012 11:44 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I understand your argument and I’m not really against it. I just don’t see a small contract given to a pitcher who could potentially have a very good year to be anything but beneficial to the team. One of the young guys may deliver the same at even cheaper (Antonio Bastardo last year) so you make a good point there. I don’t really see spending on Lidge (maybe 1 million) to really influence payroll decisions later in the season if you want to make a trade and if he’s doing well but you have other hot-hands, he himself could always be traded for a moderate return.
Jonathan Broxton, Matt capps, Octavio Dotel, Kyle Farnsworth, Jason Frasor, and LaTroy Hawkins all signed 1 year deals this offseason between 3 and 4.5 mm per (and thats not counting the 5mm deall Affeldt got.
Those are the comps for a 1 year deal for Lidge. What makes you think he’ll take a 1,000,000 deal? He’ll get at least 3mm per.
So the DOWNSIDE to that is that if he doesn’t perrform, you are severely limited when you’re up against the lux cap at the deadline.
"Sometimes, the balls that fall in are jam shots"...Hunter Pence, on BABIP
No worries...
He’ll just send better prospects in the deadline deal in exchange for cash to keep them under the luxury cap.
wish I was kidding….
Maybe he could just sign Lidge for prospects instead of salary, and save a lot of heartache later on.
If Lidge took that much money to sign, it wouldn’t be a good contract. His options seem limited though based on his recent injury history and terrible 2009. Compared to the pitchers that you listed, he has not been as valuable in the short-term (and that can affect a relief pitchers offers by a lot, especially one that hasn’t been dominant since 2008). Madson on the other hand, if he doesn’t get any offers, who knows what he will get? Do you think he’d be a bargain at 3-5 million for a 1 year contract if he had no other options?
No way you get Madson for $3-5mm. If they agreed to $5mm, I’d sign the contract before Madson’s acid wore, because he’d have to be trippin’ to not laugh and walk out at that suggestion.
He’s going to get paid. I think contract length is the sticking point for most teams, not salary.
Some people don't think it be what it is, but it do.
by TheOrangeCone on Jan 9, 2012 3:50 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
ooooooooooooh yeah
"I remember being three and I wanted to be a baseball player, that's all I ever really wanted to be. That and Spider Man." -Raul Ibanez
Ruben Amaro Jr. Delenda Est
by Jose and the Contrarians on Jan 5, 2012 1:31 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
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